fsmithred | gnarface, I have more info on that syslog problem I was having. | 00:03 |
---|---|---|
fsmithred | The place in the log where the corruption occurs does not correspond to the current date. | 00:04 |
gnarface | hmmm | 00:05 |
fsmithred | It happened while I was inspecting the log. Specifically, some time between greps. Grepped once and it was normal, grepped a couple minutes later it was corrupted. | 00:05 |
fsmithred | Not exactly sure what I did in between the two. Could have started a VM or a VNC over ssh session. | 00:05 |
gnarface | fsmithred: stackexchange suggests the system may have crashed during a write to syslog | 00:06 |
fsmithred | I would notice a system crash, wouldn't I? | 00:06 |
gnarface | https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/477537/system-crash-strange-chars-in-syslog | 00:06 |
gnarface | in theory if the whole thing crashed, but if it was just syslog itself, or something reporting to it, i don't know | 00:06 |
gnarface | the stackexchange link also reminds me that ^@ is the NUL character | 00:07 |
gnarface | so that's a clue about where the data could have come from | 00:08 |
gnarface | uninitialized ram or disk space i guess? | 00:08 |
gnarface | these people posting replies to the stackexchange link seem to know more about it than me | 00:08 |
fsmithred | I was starting to think hardware problem. This is the laptop that doesn't like to boot from my hard drive in legacy mode. I have to boot from CD and chainload to hard drive. | 00:08 |
gnarface | you said you had a suspect disk in there at some point previously, i'm wondering if this could have been caused by it responding too slowly to some I/O operation during boot-up | 00:08 |
gnarface | which still seems like bad behavior for syslog to me, and very possibly should be considered a bug, but would also explain why so few people have ever seen this one | 00:09 |
fsmithred | pretty sure the disk itself is good. It's worked fine in two other computers, and it's only six months old. It's a laptop ssd. (sata) | 00:09 |
gnarface | oh, i thought you said you had moved the install and possibly the syslogs from an older disk | 00:10 |
fsmithred | no, moved the disk. | 00:10 |
gnarface | ah | 00:10 |
gnarface | hmm | 00:10 |
fsmithred | this computer also refuses to boot from usb. It's a T420 | 00:10 |
fsmithred | I can chainload to the usb to boot it. If I set bios to boot usb, it tries to find a network boot. | 00:11 |
fsmithred | Probably needs bios update - I think it has the original. | 00:11 |
fsmithred | running memtest now | 00:16 |
gnarface | fsmithred: about the USB thing, did i suggest you try a different USB port? | 00:21 |
gnarface | fsmithred: one of them might be hooked to the bios specially for FEL boot mode or something similar | 00:22 |
gnarface | it could be confused about certain usb key formats | 00:22 |
gnarface | but with the ARM devices i've seen that do that, it's typically just one specific port | 00:22 |
gnarface | (and usually the one nearest the power jack) | 00:23 |
gnarface | or wait, was this the device that only had one USB port? | 00:23 |
gnarface | something else i've seen is machines that can't boot from anything larger than 2GB in physical size (regardless of partitioning) | 00:27 |
gnarface | Dell at least was guilty of shipping machines with bioses crippled in such a way, years after it should have become standard functionality | 00:28 |
gnarface | for the Dell, upgrading to the latest bios didn't help, but for your thinkpad maybe you'll have better luck | 00:28 |
gnarface | for the Dell, the physical boot media in any USB or SD port had to be less than 2GB total but the limitation did not apply to the SATA ports. (i was unable to locate a CF card to test with) | 00:30 |
gnarface | and judging by the boot speed it was accessing the flash drives in PIO mode | 00:31 |
gnarface | hmmm | 00:32 |
gnarface | looking at the info online it says that machine was released in 2011, definitely late enough that it should be able to support flash and sd cards greater than 2GB in size (the SDHC spec as opposed to just the base "SD" spec) | 00:33 |
systemdlete | estimated end of life for ascii? | 02:32 |
systemdlete | is there a web page for LTS and EOL? | 02:33 |
systemdlete | (with dates, I mean!) | 02:33 |
systemdlete | is this even known/estimated at this time? | 02:36 |
golinux | systemdlete: Same as for Debian Stretch | 02:37 |
systemdlete | ok. Is that generally going to be the policy into the future? | 02:37 |
golinux | afaik | 02:37 |
systemdlete | great. Good to know. I always forget these things. | 02:38 |
Evilham | in case someone comes complain about IPv6 breaking things: there is a mirror on deb.debian.org misbehaving, so it's out of our control | 12:27 |
Evilham | (aka: not IPv6 breaking things, something somewhere is broken and it happens to have an AAAA record) | 12:27 |
xinomilo | translations suggestion: move that away from git. not easy for syncing languages, nor for non-techish contributors. | 14:09 |
xinomilo | use weblate or something.. | 14:10 |
xinomilo | will probably open up an issue for discussion | 14:17 |
Evilham | Weblate isnt good for long things, is it? | 16:46 |
xinomilo | not sure :) haven't used it really. | 16:51 |
xinomilo | mostly using translate.wordpress.org and trad.framasoft.org lately. | 16:53 |
xinomilo | transifex many years ago, but stopped after the proprietary thing. | 16:54 |
Evilham | I have used it, and it's good for small strings, but for longer things it's a bit of a PITA | 16:54 |
Evilham | so I act as a bad translator and leave the long text to someone else | 16:54 |
xinomilo | hehe | 16:55 |
xinomilo | rather an occasional translator here, not regular | 16:56 |
Evilham | it's fine, proposals are not a bad thing, it's just in the end... handling text files is still the easiest universal thing | 16:57 |
xinomilo | sure, forgot to say: still using pads mostly | 16:58 |
tarzeau | will devuan also make uvuntu ? | 18:23 |
furrywolf | no | 18:24 |
furrywolf | unless you want to, of course. :) | 18:25 |
tarzeau | i want to create updated iso images of livecd.gnustep.org but i fear there's no easy way to make a live cd of devuan? | 18:26 |
furrywolf | devuan has a livecd, and modifications to it should be easy, but you'd have to ask someone who knows more about it... I've never even used it. | 18:31 |
golinux | Devuan has refractasnapshot and refractainstaller. That's how we make our live cds | 18:36 |
golinux | tarzeau: That is in the devuan repos https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/d1pkgweb-query?search=refractasnapshot&release=any | 18:38 |
james1138 | I came in late to the conversation. Furrywolf: did you indicate a possibility there maybe a Ubuntu without systemd??? | 19:03 |
golinux | NO! | 19:05 |
golinux | Unless some wants to do it. Unlikely anyone in our camp | 19:05 |
james1138 | That is fine with me. I am staying with Devuan anyway. | 19:15 |
james1138 | I do not know if this would be a Devuan question and apologize if not. Is there any suggestions on how to play/listen to WMA format music files? If not - would anyone have suggestions on converting WMA files to MP3? I found some music files on an old windows backup archive that I put on a DVD a long time ago and like to listen to them. | 20:14 |
fsmithred | james1138, I can play wma files with audacious, mpv or vlc. | 20:19 |
james1138 | I shall try installing MPV then and cross my fingers. | 20:19 |
fsmithred | what player do you have? | 20:20 |
james1138 | Mplayer | 20:20 |
fsmithred | that should work | 20:20 |
omnio | probably smplayer works too, it uses mpv/mplayer | 20:20 |
fsmithred | I just converted wma to occ with winff | 20:21 |
james1138 | I tried. I am worried that the old WMA may have some funky Microsoft protections. | 20:21 |
fsmithred | If that's the case, play it on an old windows box and run the audio output to audio input in your linux box. Re-record it. | 20:22 |
james1138 | yeap! Tried WinFF and got - Error while decoding stream #0:0: Operation not permitted | 20:23 |
fsmithred | I don't know for sure if you can go directly from output to input or if you need to run it through an amplifier first. | 20:25 |
fsmithred | or a tape deck | 20:25 |
DonkeyHotei | wma files have been fully supported by ffmpeg for ages | 20:27 |
fsmithred | even with drm? | 20:27 |
james1138 | I made sure I already have also installed FFMpeg and Lame. | 20:29 |
fsmithred | maybe there's some place on the internet where you could download an unfettered copy. | 20:30 |
DonkeyHotei | worst case is you make a windows vm to export the files without drm | 20:30 |
james1138 | ThANKS ALL | 20:34 |
james1138 | Sorry - caps lock on | 20:34 |
MinceR | curl -6sI -H 'Host: deb.devuan.org' 'http://[2001:638:a000:1021:21::1]/merged/pool/' | 21:37 |
MinceR | is this 404 normal? | 21:37 |
MinceR | (asking for a shy friend) | 21:39 |
MinceR | > oh, wait, it happens on all of them with merged/pool/ | 21:40 |
nemo | what's supposed to be in there? | 21:43 |
nemo | sure doesn't seem like a real path | 21:43 |
AntoFox | o/ | 21:43 |
nemo | \o | 21:43 |
AntoFox | just for MATE 1.22 users, need to rebuild and update hezeh repo | 21:44 |
AntoFox | same situation for cinnamon | 21:44 |
AntoFox | some packages have dipendenza not satisfied | 21:44 |
nemo | AntoFox: hezeh repo is to fix power management and such? | 21:45 |
AntoFox | I fixed time ago, mate-power-manager should work | 21:47 |
AntoFox | if there are problems let me know via: https://dev1galaxy.org/ or mail | 21:47 |
AntoFox | or in the telegram groups | 21:48 |
MinceR | dunno, but the shy user says it got fixed since | 21:51 |
james1138 | Question. I am thinking about using "Gnome-Flashback"/"Classic Gnome" when after I get my hands on the Devuan Beowulf ISO. Thinking back - I am using XFCE but still have a lot of GNOME pieces/parts/dependencies in addition to the XFCE stuff and maybe going Classic Gnome desktop could result in a less cluttered working system. Does anyone know of websites that go into detail about CPU/Memory usage of GNOME 3 vs GNOME Classic/Flashback?? | 23:09 |
gnarface | nothing comes to mind, other than that there are better choices if you're looking for less clutter and resource usage | 23:12 |
gnarface | Gnome was never known as lightweight | 23:12 |
gnarface | there are several much simpler window managers that don't need any gnome parts at all | 23:13 |
gnarface | blackbox comes to mind | 23:13 |
james1138 | Gnarface: I do not want anything lighter than LXDE. I DO want an actual desktop environment. Sorry. | 23:14 |
james1138 | Mate still is a white elephant in some respects from what I read online. | 23:14 |
gnarface | i like enlightenment | 23:15 |
nemo | james1138: I think MATE's reputation is undeserved | 23:15 |
nemo | it did try to do a lot, maybe too much | 23:15 |
nemo | but it was well organised and had a lot of useful functionality | 23:16 |
nemo | of all the linux desktops I've tried with family members it's the only one that stuck | 23:16 |
nemo | my mom tried XFCE was very dissatisified | 23:16 |
nemo | she wanted the automounting of her CD rips for example which mate seamlessly handled in its vfs | 23:16 |
nemo | she was frustrated by how complicated it was to adjust the clock in xfce vs mate | 23:16 |
nemo | she had a hard time with configuration in general, although to xfce's credit they've improve the organisation of that a lot the past few years | 23:17 |
james1138 | My problem with XFCE is that when anyone dumps Orage - they also "rip out" a lot of other stuff by accident. | 23:17 |
nemo | https://l3net.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/cmp-all4.png https://flexion.org/posts/2014-03-memory-consumption-of-linux-desktop-environments/ | 23:18 |
nemo | both of these independent tests show that MATE has basically same memory consumption as XFCE these days | 23:18 |
nemo | this shouldn't be much of a surprise given MATE was originally designed for lower spec devices. | 23:18 |
nemo | XFCE *once upon a time* was lightweight. I don't think that's true anymore | 23:18 |
nemo | about 10 years ago I was still running a gentoo/xfce laptop with 96MiB of ram that ran seamonkey and abiword just fine. | 23:19 |
nemo | I doubt that's possible now | 23:19 |
james1138 | But - as I mentioned eariler. I went through my installed files and saw A LOT of GNOME stuff still there for what is supposed to be a XFCE desktop. I simply added Evolution and Cheese webcam - BAM.. a lot got installed. | 23:19 |
nemo | well not too surprising evolution is gnome dependent | 23:20 |
nemo | james1138: maybe pull the deptree for those packages? | 23:20 |
james1138 | If I am to have GNOME stuiff - seems like I should just go GNOME all the way instead mixing and matching (and risking breaking). | 23:21 |
jonadab | You don't want anything to do with modern versions of GNOME. | 23:21 |
jonadab | All the useful features have long since been removed. | 23:21 |
nemo | what did you want evolution for? | 23:22 |
nemo | IMO thunderbird is still a great option. | 23:22 |
james1138 | The modern version of GNOME assume 3D graphics and add stuff to accommodate... which I do not have on my laptop. | 23:22 |
nemo | I gave up on evolution on debian about 5 years ago after going above and beyond to make it work with MAPI | 23:22 |
nemo | switched to thunderbird which was more lightweight and quite functional | 23:23 |
nemo | james1138: MATE does not require compositing still | 23:23 |
nemo | you're right about gnome3 | 23:23 |
nemo | and kde I think | 23:23 |
nemo | even on laptops where 3d accelerated desktops work it's a strain on their wimpy cards. | 23:24 |
nemo | resources better devoted to your browser or gaming | 23:24 |
james1138 | Nemo: I tried and tried Thunderbird over and over - but for me... Thunderbird needs so many extensions and addons installed to do what Evolution does from the beginning. I had to shrug and give up on Thunderbird. | 23:24 |
* nemo shrugs | 23:25 | |
nemo | that's always been kinda their schtick though | 23:25 |
nemo | wouldn't say it's an enormous number of extensions | 23:25 |
nemo | guess it depends on what you want | 23:25 |
nemo | for me it's just been a few. lightning for example | 23:25 |
nemo | it's not like it takes more than 5 minutes to set them up in a profile | 23:26 |
nemo | and then you're done for years | 23:26 |
nemo | unlike evolution 😃 | 23:26 |
james1138 | Nemo: atleast 24 addons. Lightning, chatzilla, the theme, HTTPS Everywhere, Thunderbrowse, Thunderpluger, etc. | 23:28 |
james1138 | Google Calendar sync, Google contact sync... | 23:30 |
james1138 | ...forgot SpamAssasin | 23:32 |
gnu_srs | Hi; this is a must read: Sam is a very sensible person: https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2019/09/msg00001.html | 23:39 |
gnu_srs | Hi; this is a must read: Sam is a very sensible person: https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2019/09/msg00001.html | 23:54 |
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