libera/#devuan/ Saturday, 2020-05-09

CondorHello, I've got the resources to host a variety of services such as web and mail (and if SKS wouldn't suck possibly a keyserver too) but mirrors have always thrown me off a bit. Debian for instance requires at least 200GB storage if memory serves to carry the x86_64 architecture. It's a bit much. Right now I am already carrying all of Devuan's architectures in the ISO's through the torrents though. I would03:23
Condorlike to see init freedom succeed. What would the requirements of hosting a Devuan mirror be like?03:23
onefanghttps://pkgmaster.devuan.org/devuan_mirror_walkthrough.txt has the details.03:24
onefangYou would be talking with me or Evilham once you are ready to go ahead with that.03:26
onefangShort answer, a lot less storage needed if you redirect requests for stuff that is the same as in Debian to Debian mirrors.03:27
CondorAlright, thanks. I'll have a read there and see whether my servers are ready to host a mirror like this. What's the usual bandwidth utilization seen on these? I have 3Gbps on my edges but only 30Mbps on my actual workers, hence my concern03:28
onefanghttps://sledjhamr.org/cgp/detail.php?p=interface&pi=eth0&t=if_octets&h=sledjhamr.org&s=86400 is an interactive graph of bandwidth usage on my mirror, though it also includes other services.03:29
Condor6MB/s in short bursts.. I think I may be able to pull that off actually. Will look further into making a Devuan mirror then, thanks! :)03:32
onefangIn my case, email, XMPP, and OpenSim based virtual worlds.03:32
onefangYou are welcome.03:32
meep_____onefang: what are you doing with XMPP and opensim?04:38
onefangRunning chat servers with XMPP using Prosody.  And two grids with OpenSim.04:39
meep_____Oooooooooh!!!!04:39
meep_____How exciting!04:39
meep_____onefang: do you have an official mumble for your opensim? I can't get the secondlife voip to work reliable because it relies on i386-binary-compat and a really really really of version of gsreamer-0.1004:40
onefangNot using voice on either of them.04:41
meep_____onefang: how do I connect to your xmpp server and opensim ?04:41
meep_____Can I use phoenix?04:41
meep_____Phoenix_Firestorm-Releasex64_x86_6404:42
meep_____» There was an error getting items for chat.sledjhamr.org.04:44
meep_____» Reason: Remote server not found.04:44
meep_____» A remote server or service specified as part or all of the JID of the intended recipient does not exist.04:44
onefangIt's all private invite only stuff for activists and persecuted minority groups.  I'm not even the right person to ask for an invite.04:47
onefangFirestorm has an on again off again relationship with OpenSim.  Their current version is not recommended for OpenSim, coz it tends to crash sims on login.  You have to go back three versions for one that works properly.  I generally recommend latest Singularity, or Cool VL Viewer, even though they are v1 user interfaces that some love, some hate.04:50
meep_____onefang: I want to  join your opensim05:07
meep_____If your not the person to ask then please direct me to the correct person05:08
onefangWell off topic, let's take this private.05:09
openbsdtai123Is there a software in devuan to edit  a PDF, a bit like adobe acrobat pro writer?06:57
onefangI think LibreOffice can do that.  GIMP maybe.  Probably others.06:59
openbsdtai123devuan Libreoffice cannot do edit pdf :(  gimp I need to try but I believe not well support.07:00
openbsdtai123Inkscape eventually looks to be the only one. This one is not very good.07:00
onefangThere are PDF specific programs, some of them can edit to.07:00
iv4nshm4k0vACTION uses PDF::API2 to edit his PDFs.07:00
openbsdtai123* Installing Inkscape is bit installing KDE full :(07:01
meep_____Libreoffice can do it but it's a build time dependency07:11
openbsdtai123what it means?07:12
meep_____It means you may have to compile it yourself07:18
openbsdtai123without pkgsrc, this is going to be hard and long.07:49
openbsdtai123Is there a apt-get source somthing like this?07:50
gnarfaceopenbsdtai123: gimp can do it fine you just have to know some things08:03
gnarfaceopenbsdtai123: (like the default DPI is different from windows by +25 and you have to treat the individual pages as separate documents then combine them as layers)08:04
gnarfaceoh, and it might have to save the text all rasterized... not sure about that08:04
gnarfacei guess you're right, the support isn't great compared to acrobat pro but it should be fine if you don't need the text to be copy&pasteable from xpdf08:05
gnarfacei don't know if inkscape can do anything useful with pdfs other than export to them.  inkscape is more about SVG08:07
openbsdtai123indeed, I see inkscape for only svg making and nothing else.08:15
openbsdtai123Illustrator or adobe writer pro (remember version 4 pro adobe) or photoshop <10 were cool08:16
openbsdtai123(and 25-50 mb only with C++)08:16
gnarfacehmm, now that i'm thinking about it again the default dpi in gimp might be +28 over the windows default08:18
gnarfacebut it says right there on the panel when you open the pdf, just pay attention and you can figure it out08:18
gnarfaceand then if it's like a 20 page pdf you're gonna have to wait while it opens 20 windows :-/08:19
openbsdtai123what about the devuan package :   okular (from kde)?08:25
gnarfacei don't know anything about it08:26
openbsdtai123I heard that okular was a good pdf viewer and much more.08:27
gnarfacewell even xpdf is fine for just viewing as long as you don't need the javascript/form support08:27
gnarfacethe real reason this whole pdf situation is a mess is because Adobe couldn't stick to their own spec08:27
gnarfacethey kept sneaking extra features into acrobat pro08:28
openbsdtai123Once I installed kalzium, the apt-get okular, takes only 24mb,... sounds good, I get a try.08:28
gnarfaceat the point they added javascript, everyone else just threw their hands up in disgust08:28
openbsdtai123maybe offtopic, but why java / javascript has become so unpopular? slow maybe08:29
gnarfaceeven firefox has a pretty good built-in pdf reader now, it's just really slow08:29
golinuxThis isn't really a devuan support discussion08:29
gnarfacepoint taken08:29
openbsdtai123yeah but developers aren't aware of this production of bloat. Just the linux is just junk.08:29
openbsdtai123kernel.08:29
iv4nshm4k0vFirst of all, there's Adobe PDF, and then there's ISO 32000-1:2008; I'm not sure the latter has forms.08:45
iv4nshm4k0vThen again, if you have forms, then presumably you need (in the most general case) something Turing-complete for input validation.  Why not JavaScript, then?  (Or something on top of ECMAScript, anyway.)08:47
iv4nshm4k0vThere're worse languages in existence.  (I've used to point to Fortran 77 at the times like this; but this was before Python became widespread.)08:47
openbsdtai123I compiled ctwm from source. it needs flex, bison, shape.h, intrinsic, ... wow. is there maybe a twm like easy to compile without much libs?10:00
golinuxopenbsdtai123: Off topic for this channel10:04
tuxd3vgood Victory Day!Urra!!10:08
golinuxThat too!10:12
ullethat did we victorify11:10
ulleti was disgusted in the code in adobe postscript11:11
ullethaving just read GEB11:11
Xelraajust a suggestion to the new devuan page: that dark red color header looks ugly12:49
Xelraacyan or light blue is perfect12:49
Xelraademonstrates the freedom12:49
Guest44226openbsdtail123: *Is there a software in devuan to edit  a PDF, a bit like adobe acrobat pro writer?*14:26
Guest44226I used the libharu library for that in the past14:26
Guest44226when i was working on a set of tools for that, but i just found the following interface to the Haru PDF library, named LuaHPDF:14:29
Guest44226https://forums.indigorose.com/forum/autoplay-media-studio-8-5/autoplay-media-studio-8-plugins-and-addons/35386-luahpdf-libharu14:30
Guest44226Here you are the git repository:14:57
Guest44226https://github.com/jung-kurt/luahpdf14:58
specingDoes anyone here have devuan in LXC containers?16:28
specingLooking for a script to create them16:28
iv4nshm4k0vACTION uses plain good old debootstrap(8) to create his containers.16:30
iv4nshm4k0vACTION has updated his root-squashfs Debian testing image just yesterday… though that’s somewhat OT here.16:33
specingiv4nshm4k0v: yes ok, but some more setup is usually necessary16:35
specingat least for gentoo it is16:35
iv4nshm4k0vspecing: In my case it was either reading someone else’s code or writing my own; and, well, the former is more effort.16:40
iv4nshm4k0vBesides, I don’t need dozens of containers; rather, I use a handful of base images with a variety of data (along the lines of one / with different /home filesystems mounted.)16:43
specingiv4nshm4k0v: doesen't matter with btrfs/zfs16:55
iv4nshm4k0vspecing: I tend to disagree.16:57
iv4nshm4k0vspecing: Assuming I understand your point correctly, Btrfs/Zfs are akin to neural networks: they get you /some/ result that works, but that pretty much disallows any analysis.17:00
koollmaniv4nshm4k0v: I don't quite see the comparison there17:01
koollmanspecing: I have not updated any. last time I needed one, I went with jessie template, modified it to install devuan jessie instead, then upgraded. But most debian-based lxc templates use debootstrap anyway17:04
koollmanspecing: https://git.devuan.org/gregolsen/lxc-devuan this one looks nice enough17:07
specingCoool, koollman17:09

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