| udn44 | does anyone know what is the automatic method for loading non-device/hardware kernel modules such as ext4, crc, aes, nft_tables and other fs, crypto and protocol related modules? Is it also handled by udev/eudev or another mechanism? | 00:35 |
|---|---|---|
| rrq | udn44: I think modules mentioned in "/etc/modules" are loaded automagically during boot up | 01:25 |
| udn44 | Afaik "/etc/modules" is empty by default on Deb/Dev and so is "/etc/modprobe.d/" | 02:26 |
| udn44 | do you believe it might be a different /etc/modules used to build initrd? | 02:27 |
| rrq | there's also /etc/initramfs-tools/modules and /usr/share/initramfs-tools/modules.d/* for modules to load at initrd stage .. start with "man initramfs.conf" | 02:40 |
| udn44 | rrq: both are also empty... I believe when you use a cryptloop cipher, mount with a new fs type or try to handle a new protocol or iptables/nft helper, these kernel modules load on demand... I am just wondering who does it, since my understanding was that udevd only reacted to device/hardware based events signaled from the kernel and not from user | 02:49 |
| udn44 | space tools | 02:49 |
| gnarface | udn44: look in ls /lib/modules/`uname -r` | 02:51 |
| gnarface | udn44: sorry to be clear "ls /lib/modules/`uname -r`" | 02:51 |
| gnarface | udn44: look at the .dep files in there | 02:51 |
| rrq | udn44: you might need to follow up the initramfs scripting of the package(s) involved | 02:52 |
| gnarface | yea, the initramfs has it's own thing, but it's separate | 02:52 |
| gnarface | it kinda replicates the process | 02:52 |
| udn44 | yep, I see we have several thousand modules in there... but, is there a userspace tool that loads them or is the kernel loading them directly | 02:52 |
| gnarface | but modules can still be loaded after boot automatically, the old way, afaik | 02:52 |
| rrq | udn44: eg from "dpkg -L $package | grep initramfs" | 02:52 |
| rrq | that scripting has two parts: script for building intramfs and scripts executed duting initrd init | 02:53 |
| rrq | during | 02:53 |
| gnarface | udn44: this module-init-tools used to be the thing i'm talking about (the one separate from initramfs) but i'm seeing now they seem to have canged it to something called "kmod" as of ceres, at least, not sure about beowulf | 02:54 |
| gnarface | udn44: yea this ceres install has been upgraded for years. i'm not sure when module-init-tools went away but it's kmod as of beowulf too | 02:55 |
| udn44 | lsmod | grep "nf_" | 02:58 |
| gnarface | wrong window? | 02:59 |
| udn44 | I just cannot understand how these nf modules are not loaded during boot (initramfs) but come up on-demand, *but* without a hardware event hook which is what I thought triggered udev | 03:01 |
| gnarface | no, it's a software hook event for sure, it comes from the kernel, and i think calls a userspace tool | 03:01 |
| gnarface | i'm not 100% clear on it either | 03:02 |
| gnarface | but i don't think it invovles udev at all | 03:02 |
| udn44 | the only search result I get is initram/modules/modprobe or udev | 03:02 |
| gnarface | i could be wrong | 03:02 |
| udn44 | right, I hope so | 03:02 |
| gnarface | did you look at the kmod package? | 03:02 |
| gnarface | for boot it's initramfs tools, but after boot it is probably the kmod package | 03:02 |
| gnarface | (though they may be intertwined directly somehow) | 03:02 |
| gnarface | (but that only is if you are actually using an initramfs, which is the default but not a strict requirement) | 03:03 |
| udn44 | yep, but my understanding is that these are user land control tools, there is no running daemon like udevd on kmod | 03:03 |
| udn44 | gnar and rrq, thanks for trying, ill keep researching and chime here my findings | 03:13 |
| Admiral_Purr | Hello there. Good morning from here. Are all Debian packages available for Devuan? | 07:55 |
| golinux | Admiral_Purr: All except these: https://pkgmaster.devuan.org/bannedpackages.txt | 07:59 |
| Admiral_Purr | Thanks. Will have a look. | 07:59 |
| golinux | You can check available packages here: https://pkginfo.devuan.org/ | 07:59 |
| Admiral_Purr | Great | 08:04 |
| zalckos | does devuan use the linux-libre kernel? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux-libre | 10:59 |
| zalckos | in other words, are there proprietary blobs present by default? | 10:59 |
| zalckos | or does it mirror Debian's philosophy? https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/288027/what-are-the-differences-between-debian-linux-kernel-and-linux-libre | 11:02 |
| xinomilo | devuan uses debian kernel | 11:06 |
| zalckos | ah ok ty | 11:08 |
| xinomilo | but you can use linux-libre if you like in devuan too.. | 11:10 |
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