| melodie | thks sgage | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
| melodie | is there a forum of some kind dedicated to Devuan? | 00:02 |
| fsmithred | dev1galaxy.org | 00:07 |
| fsmithred | melodie, ^^^ | 00:07 |
| melodie | yes? | 00:10 |
| melodie | thanks fsmithred | 00:10 |
| melodie | I have bookmarked it | 00:10 |
| fsmithred | yw | 00:10 |
| melodie | :) | 00:10 |
| fsmithred | see you there | 00:10 |
| melodie | sure | 00:10 |
| fsmithred | how much did you remove? | 00:11 |
| melodie | I also have a few more questions about what is the thing related to users when installing | 00:11 |
| melodie | lots | 00:11 |
| fsmithred | don't paste a lot of lines here | 00:11 |
| melodie | let me show you on a pastebin | 00:11 |
| fsmithred | ok | 00:11 |
| melodie | don't worry | 00:11 |
| fsmithred | or paste.debian.net | 00:11 |
| fsmithred | (no javascript there) | 00:11 |
| melodie | http://pastebin.fr/89216 | 00:12 |
| melodie | fsmithred I am scrutinizing in it to reinstall a few packages which might help | 00:12 |
| fsmithred | me too | 00:13 |
| fsmithred | was this an upgrade from ascii? | 00:14 |
| melodie | what is ascii ? | 00:15 |
| melodie | so far I reinstalled gir1.2-polkit-1.0 packagekit packagekit-tools and their depends | 00:16 |
| fsmithred | ascii=stretch (oldstable) | 00:19 |
| melodie | no I downloaded the ISO yesterday | 00:20 |
| fsmithred | maybe you need to keep some pinentry stuff | 00:20 |
| melodie | there is pinentry-gnome installed | 00:20 |
| fsmithred | oh, ok | 00:20 |
| melodie | and all of them are presented as x windows for gpg | 00:20 |
| fsmithred | so you know that's working | 00:20 |
| melodie | no i don't, I haven't used any gpg passphrase in that machine | 00:21 |
| melodie | I'll reboot it, I haven't, since the update, and I just reinstalled a few packages | 00:21 |
| melodie | let me see how it goes after reboot | 00:21 |
| fsmithred | ok | 00:21 |
| fsmithred | I couldn't find anyting obvious | 00:22 |
| melodie | neither did I | 00:22 |
| melodie | how old is yesterday's iso? (the one with Xfce4) | 00:22 |
| fsmithred | 3.1.1? | 00:22 |
| fsmithred | few days old | 00:22 |
| melodie | so it might have some bugs | 00:23 |
| melodie | I'll test it again in Virtualbox | 00:23 |
| fsmithred | what bugs? | 00:23 |
| fsmithred | you used a mirror during the install? | 00:23 |
| melodie | I have provided a user name and password at the end of the install | 00:23 |
| melodie | and it has created a user "devuan" associated with my user name, but no user of the name I gave | 00:24 |
| fsmithred | did you install from the desktop-live iso? | 00:24 |
| melodie | no /home/something, just /home/devuan | 00:24 |
| melodie | let me check the name of the ISO | 00:24 |
| fsmithred | you did | 00:24 |
| fsmithred | unless you chose the name devuan | 00:24 |
| melodie | devuan_beowulf_3.1.1_i386_desktop-live.iso | 00:24 |
| melodie | also the way things are presented for the names and users lacks clarity | 00:25 |
| melodie | it is confusing | 00:25 |
| melodie | I will just replay the install in Virtualbox and ask questions at the forum from the Virtualbox experience | 00:26 |
| fsmithred | check the install guide, too | 00:26 |
| fsmithred | I'll get the link | 00:26 |
| fsmithred | oh, I think it's on the desktop in the live iso, too | 00:26 |
| melodie | now I would like to solve this thing around rights and permissions, for the "Users and Groups" tool as well, as I have installed gnome-system-tools and the users tool does not provide me with a choice of providing a password | 00:27 |
| fsmithred | https://www.devuan.org/os/documentation/install-guides/beowulf/live-gui | 00:27 |
| melodie | just had an idea : I'll check if gnome-keyring is installed | 00:28 |
| fsmithred | also, 'id devuan' | 00:28 |
| melodie | thank you | 00:28 |
| melodie | yes? | 00:28 |
| fsmithred | how many users are there and what are their uid:gid and groups? | 00:28 |
| fsmithred | sounds like something got messed up in the install | 00:29 |
| melodie | yes, possible | 00:29 |
| melodie | there is "root" and there is "devuan" who also calls himself by the user name I provided at the end of the install | 00:29 |
| fsmithred | ok, that does not make sense to me | 00:30 |
| melodie | this is why I'll check the doc you just gave me, and redo the install in virtualbox tomorrow | 00:30 |
| fsmithred | ls /home | 00:30 |
| fsmithred | how many user directories are there? | 00:30 |
| melodie | fsmithred I confess it doesn't for me either | 00:30 |
| melodie | one : /home/devuan | 00:30 |
| fsmithred | id devuan | 00:30 |
| melodie | 1000 | 00:30 |
| fsmithred | should be 1000 | 00:30 |
| melodie | it is | 00:30 |
| fsmithred | so where is this other name you're talking about | 00:31 |
| fsmithred | ? | 00:31 |
| fsmithred | is that just the user's "Real name"? | 00:31 |
| melodie | at the end of the install I have never told it to name the user devuan I thought I would name the machine devuan, not the user | 00:31 |
| fsmithred | the hostname is devuan, the user name is devuan and the user password is devuan. | 00:31 |
| melodie | the other user is a generic one I use a lot | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | the installer asks if you want to chage all of those | 00:32 |
| melodie | I will double check tomorrow | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | yeah, but does that other user exist? | 00:32 |
| melodie | and fix it in the install | 00:32 |
| melodie | not it doesn't | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | grep otheruser /etc/passwd | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | yeah, reinstall can take 10 minutes | 00:33 |
| melodie | fsmithred no, it's an old machine, with a pata ssd | 00:33 |
| melodie | where I have already done a lot of writings | 00:33 |
| melodie | in /etc/password : | 00:34 |
| melodie | let's say the user is me: melodie | 00:34 |
| melodie | devuan:x:1000:1000:melodie,,,:/home/devuan:/bin/bash | 00:34 |
| melodie | I don't understand :-( | 00:35 |
| fsmithred | you could drop to console, login as root, kill the xsession, deluser melodie, rm -r /home/devuan | 00:35 |
| fsmithred | and then adduser melodie | 00:35 |
| fsmithred | assuming there's no user named devuan in /etc/passwd | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | or group devuan in /etc/group | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | oh | 00:36 |
| melodie | yes, there is devuan, look again : devuan:x:1000:1000:melodie,,,:/home/devuan:/bin/bash | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | user is devuan group is melodie | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | yeah | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | I read it wrong the first time | 00:36 |
| melodie | very strange | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | deluser devuan, delgroup melodie, rm -r /home/devuan, adduser melodie | 00:37 |
| melodie | ok fsmithred I'll see you on the forum | 00:37 |
| melodie | what is better, deluser or userdel ? | 00:37 |
| fsmithred | deluser is a debian script, userdel is the underlying command | 00:37 |
| fsmithred | deluser and adduser are easier | 00:38 |
| fsmithred | they do more | 00:38 |
| melodie | ok | 00:38 |
| fsmithred | you can modify the behavior in /etc/adduser.conf | 00:38 |
| fsmithred | if you can save /var/log/refractainstaller.log from this installation, I'd like to see it. | 00:39 |
| fsmithred | you can email me through the forum | 00:39 |
| crashoverride | gosh, UEFI is so terribad... | 00:40 |
| fsmithred | it would be less bad if motherboard manufacturers stuck to the specs | 00:41 |
| fsmithred | time for food | 00:41 |
| melodie | uefi are a pain | 00:42 |
| fsmithred | tell me about it | 00:42 |
| fsmithred | lol | 00:42 |
| melodie | yes | 00:42 |
| fsmithred | see you later | 00:42 |
| melodie | cheers | 00:42 |
| melodie | fsmithred new user : starting synaptic now triggers a window! | 00:45 |
| melodie | a gui window! | 00:45 |
| melodie | I'm happy! | 00:45 |
| melodie | I bet the packagekit packages reinstalls have done the trick | 00:46 |
| melodie | next on to the other little issues | 00:46 |
| crashoverride | melodie: are you melodie from #gandi? | 00:50 |
| melodie | hi crashoverride I am one of their clients | 00:51 |
| crashoverride | nah I meant on the IRC channel; but yes, then, I suppose that answers my question :P | 00:52 |
| crashoverride | and so, bonsoir :) | 00:52 |
| melodie | bonsoir crashoverride :) | 00:55 |
| melodie | this Devuan distro is incredible | 00:58 |
| melodie | I am playing the stream of a Swiss radio in mpv, by just dropping the URL into it, it does not lag or anyting : the machine is Asus 4000 A4D : 18 years old | 00:58 |
| melodie | with cpu AMD 3000+ 32bits 1.8Ghz | 00:59 |
| melodie | and RAM (added by myself) PC 2700 333Mhz 2x1 GB | 00:59 |
| melodie | the hard drive replaced with a 32GB PATA SSD Kingston | 00:59 |
| melodie | that's a challenge! \o/ | 01:00 |
| melodie | going to make pancakes to celebrate now ^^ | 01:00 |
| specing | why would playing music lag? | 01:08 |
| melodie | specing on youtube in a web browser in a 18 years old laptop? | 01:09 |
| specing | > web browser | 01:10 |
| specing | there's your problem #1 | 01:10 |
| specing | and youtube is #2 | 01:10 |
| melodie | on youtube, in epiphany-browser the music does not lag, only the video | 01:10 |
| melodie | this can be turned around by dl the video | 01:10 |
| melodie | what light audio reader is there for Devuan? I looked for deadbeef but it's not in the repos | 01:11 |
| crashoverride | melodie: devuan is essentially what linux distros should be. | 01:11 |
| melodie | nor xmms legacy. | 01:11 |
| melodie | crashoverride agreed | 01:11 |
| crashoverride | melodie: but people don't value FOSS, and there are good reasons for that: free means doomed, eventually. | 01:11 |
| melodie | doomed how? | 01:11 |
| crashoverride | there's no income to power the development. | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | so it always starts with someone skilled | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | and eventually they need money or to stop | 01:12 |
| golinux | Appropriated and monetized you mean | 01:12 |
| melodie | I have pushed my clients into linux boxes for years and even more the last 3 years, they won't go back to windows unless forced | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | mainly, because they got stuff to pay on their end. | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | right? | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | and so, they gotta stop. | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | and who can afford to continue? students. | 01:12 |
| melodie | crashoverride it's mostly true | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | FOSS is essentially software development from interns as a service. | 01:12 |
| crashoverride | (if you ignore the few diehards like fsmithred here) | 01:13 |
| crashoverride | gosh, I'm never gonna be able to boot that encrypted stuff... | 01:13 |
| crashoverride | it's not devuan, it's a rescue system from another distro (alpine), but if anyon knows how to manually boot into an encrypted lvm volume... | 01:14 |
| crashoverride | I'm really interested. :) | 01:14 |
| crashoverride | or, simply, how to switch grub to debug, because it really crashes | 01:14 |
| crashoverride | daaaamnit | 01:17 |
| melodie | do you have your password ? | 01:18 |
| melodie | if the answer is yes, then do you have the right keyboard layout? | 01:19 |
| crashoverride | it really hangs. | 01:19 |
| crashoverride | like, I don't even get to the passphrase. | 01:19 |
| crashoverride | I have `(grub)> boot` | 01:19 |
| melodie | have you passed a smart test on the drive? | 01:19 |
| crashoverride | and that's the last thing on the screen. | 01:19 |
| crashoverride | yeah it's all good. | 01:19 |
| crashoverride | should do more than that anyway, even with a bad drive. | 01:19 |
| melodie | try booting my bento openbox version, and when prompted the password provide it. https://downloads.linuxvillage.org | 01:20 |
| melodie | the polkit authorization is meant to ease access to hard drive volumes | 01:20 |
| melodie | same with gvfs and gvfs-backends installed | 01:21 |
| melodie | the file manager is pcmanfm | 01:21 |
| crashoverride | it's not possible, that's a VM, I can change a few parameters, but not use a custom iso right up | 01:21 |
| melodie | why can't you start an iso in another vm you setup as slave or whatever and mount the other vm? | 01:22 |
| crashoverride | as slave? | 01:22 |
| fsmithred | crashoverride, yes I know how to mount encrypted lvm | 01:27 |
| fsmithred | you can boot an iso with the virtual hard disk attached? | 01:28 |
| crashoverride | yeah I can | 01:30 |
| crashoverride | one sec' | 01:30 |
| crashoverride | so it kinda worked out, but it says "booting in blind mode" and I have literally no idea why. | 01:30 |
| crashoverride | I inserted the right modules. | 01:31 |
| crashoverride | also, hangs, again v_v | 01:31 |
| crashoverride | gotta reboot I guess. | 01:31 |
| fsmithred | in qemu or something else? | 01:31 |
| crashoverride | smartos, bhyve | 01:31 |
| fsmithred | ? | 01:31 |
| crashoverride | illumos | 01:31 |
| melodie | lol | 01:31 |
| crashoverride | why lol? | 01:32 |
| melodie | great! | 01:32 |
| crashoverride | but I mean I can boot things on it. | 01:32 |
| melodie | because it's so rare to hear about it I didn't even know other people still knew it existed | 01:32 |
| crashoverride | my problem is grub with a linux. :) | 01:32 |
| crashoverride | ah? | 01:32 |
| crashoverride | well, I mean, I work with BSD a lot, too | 01:32 |
| melodie | isn't BSD and family supposed to have their own bootloader that superseeds all others? | 01:33 |
| melodie | I mean that are *the* master of the game? | 01:33 |
| crashoverride | well, it's a linux VM | 01:33 |
| crashoverride | so it's not BSD. | 01:33 |
| fsmithred | cryptsetup luksOpen /dev/sdxY <label> | 01:33 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: I don't even get there... | 01:34 |
| fsmithred | vgdisplay, lvdisplay to get names | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | I can totally mount it from the rescue drive... | 01:34 |
| fsmithred | yeah, but I need to return to the kitchen | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | I know about vgscan and vgchange -a y | 01:34 |
| fsmithred | ok, cool | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | I used that a lot | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | but right now, my problem is: | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | I boot the VM, I get a screen... grub menu... I can drop to the shell or anything | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | and then, nothing | 01:34 |
| melodie | excuse me : what small audio reader is there for Devuan? Small with a light footprint? | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | and it hangs. | 01:34 |
| crashoverride | mpg321? | 01:35 |
| crashoverride | there's also mpg123 | 01:35 |
| crashoverride | mplayer, I guess. | 01:35 |
| fsmithred | moc | 01:35 |
| crashoverride | ffmpeg could work | 01:35 |
| fsmithred | mocp | 01:35 |
| melodie | crashoverride that would be text mode I guess I need gui for end users | 01:35 |
| crashoverride | ah, I didn't know moc | 01:35 |
| crashoverride | also, aplay :D | 01:35 |
| * crashoverride hides | 01:35 | |
| fsmithred | audacious is light | 01:35 |
| crashoverride | melodie: ah ok | 01:35 |
| melodie | fsmithred yes, I'll do that | 01:35 |
| buZz | mp3blaster | 01:35 |
| buZz | Full-screen console mp3 and Ogg Vorbis player | 01:36 |
| melodie | buZz I'll have a look, thank you | 01:36 |
| fsmithred | crashoverride, do you know your way around booting from grub prompt? | 01:36 |
| melodie | Mp3blaster is an audio player for the text console | 01:36 |
| melodie | not for the end users then | 01:36 |
| melodie | unless they are geeks, which they often are not | 01:37 |
| crashoverride | gosh darn it | 01:37 |
| buZz | why not? | 01:37 |
| crashoverride | I REALLY can't fix that... | 01:37 |
| melodie | buZz because they get scared | 01:37 |
| buZz | thats good | 01:37 |
| crashoverride | fear is never good. | 01:37 |
| melodie | buZz why is it? | 01:37 |
| crashoverride | it can save your life, but it never is. | 01:37 |
| crashoverride | it's a safety net. | 01:37 |
| crashoverride | and hitting the safety net is never good. | 01:37 |
| melodie | for now let's save the computers | 01:38 |
| crashoverride | I know our society is complacent about being lying down in safety nets... | 01:38 |
| buZz | melodie: you cant grow remaining in safe zones | 01:38 |
| melodie | from being dismantled, poor machines | 01:38 |
| crashoverride | but that's not because it's popular that it's a good example :D | 01:38 |
| melodie | buZz I'm not concerned | 01:38 |
| melodie | my users are | 01:38 |
| golinux | Isn't this getting a little far from devuan support? | 01:38 |
| melodie | buZz I'll try mp3blaster for myself though | 01:39 |
| golinux | try #devuan-offtopic | 01:39 |
| melodie | golinux fully in the topic | 01:39 |
| crashoverride | maybe I should do screenshots to show you guys what is happening... | 01:39 |
| melodie | I am getting help finish polishing my very first Devuan install for a very old laptop | 01:39 |
| golinux | Armchair psychology? | 01:40 |
| melodie | ? | 01:40 |
| golinux | fear and safety nets and . . . | 01:40 |
| melodie | … | 01:41 |
| melodie | golinux I save old machines for end users this time it's thanks to Devuan | 01:41 |
| fsmithred | crashoverride, were you talking about full-disk-encryption earlier? | 01:42 |
| golinux | melodie: That's a good project. | 01:43 |
| melodie | thanks golinux | 01:43 |
| adhoc | ongoing support for older machines is always a challenge | 01:44 |
| adhoc | I moced most my older machines from a variety of out of support debian to devuan last winter | 01:44 |
| crashoverride | yeah. | 01:44 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: I have a UEFI partition that has a EFI binary | 01:44 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: I have a boot partition with a grub setup, an initramfs, vmlinuz and some other files | 01:45 |
| crashoverride | (configuration and modules) | 01:45 |
| fsmithred | boot partition is not encrypted? | 01:45 |
| melodie | adhoc I tried many in vbox yesterday, I even tried my own spins in the machine, but my spins work less well! | 01:45 |
| melodie | even though they have openbox as desktop | 01:46 |
| adhoc | melodie: well with practice comes understanding =) | 01:46 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: no | 01:46 |
| adhoc | I am on my nine spin up of a flatcar install on a VM so the install to metal will be easier | 01:46 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: it's a system I'm migrating from syslinux | 01:47 |
| crashoverride | I made screenshots of the problem | 01:47 |
| crashoverride | I'm trying to find a place to push them | 01:47 |
| adhoc | melodie: I know flatcar has nothing to do with devuan, but work has different needs =) | 01:47 |
| melodie | ? | 01:54 |
| adhoc | melodie: the more you work with these systems, the faster you skills with it will grow =) | 01:54 |
| melodie | I still can't learn howto code, I can't find time for that kind of thing | 01:55 |
| adhoc | you can build up your skills. | 01:55 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: https://pasteboard.co/JUM7RX7.png https://pasteboard.co/JUM8m9E.png https://pasteboard.co/JUM8Bh3.png | 01:55 |
| melodie | so I just remix and tweak with the same refined recipe | 01:55 |
| crashoverride | in the order the screens are in. | 01:55 |
| adhoc | melodie: that is the beginning of it all =) | 01:55 |
| melodie | adhoc yes, almost 12 years now ^^ | 01:56 |
| melodie | from pclinuxos to ubuntu and lately antiX | 01:56 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: ok apparently the uploads didn't work | 01:56 |
| crashoverride | one sec' | 01:56 |
| melodie | isn't there a remix / snapshot script in Devuan? | 01:56 |
| fsmithred | melodie, yes. refractasnapshot | 01:57 |
| adhoc | melodie: "remix" script ? | 01:57 |
| melodie | fsmithred I'll give it a whirl! | 01:57 |
| fsmithred | refractasnapshot-base and refractasnapshot-gui | 01:57 |
| melodie | nice to know! | 01:57 |
| fsmithred | https://refracta.org/docs/readme.refractasnapshot.txt | 01:58 |
| melodie | I'll bookmark it for now, thank you very much | 01:58 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: https://wtf.roflcopter.fr/pics/TlokAfJB/9a4dg8Me.png https://wtf.roflcopter.fr/pics/bcVsQPGK/PXadYzce.png https://wtf.roflcopter.fr/pics/ubFyNt14/v7TB6byD.png | 02:03 |
| crashoverride | now working. | 02:03 |
| crashoverride | in the order they are happening. | 02:03 |
| crashoverride | third screen gets stuck. | 02:04 |
| crashoverride | like, for hours if I let it. | 02:04 |
| fsmithred | shouldn't be hours | 02:05 |
| fsmithred | how did you make the efi boot image? | 02:06 |
| fsmithred | for refractasnapshot I had to add some modules to avoid the blind mode error | 02:06 |
| melodie | fsmithred try adding "noquiet" at the end of the linux line and after that to end the line : -- | 02:07 |
| melodie | also this no video mode found, you could try "vga=ask" | 02:08 |
| melodie | (without the quotes) | 02:08 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: the efi boot image was done by using the default install, and editing the gpt partition in via xxd. | 02:08 |
| crashoverride | because it was the wrong one. | 02:09 |
| fsmithred | the boot option adds more grub modules? | 02:09 |
| melodie | ok, good night, or well, a good one | 02:09 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: ? | 02:09 |
| fsmithred | good night mel | 02:09 |
| crashoverride | gnite melodie | 02:09 |
| melodie | thks fsmithred | 02:09 |
| melodie | thanks crashoverride | 02:09 |
| crashoverride | but then I was able to boot without encryption | 02:09 |
| fsmithred | modules=all... | 02:09 |
| fsmithred | what's that? | 02:09 |
| crashoverride | can I do that? | 02:09 |
| crashoverride | or wait, what do you mean? | 02:10 |
| fsmithred | look at your second screenshot | 02:10 |
| fsmithred | linux line has additional words on it | 02:10 |
| fsmithred | I don't know what they mean | 02:10 |
| crashoverride | it's not all, it's `all_video` | 02:11 |
| fsmithred | my question... | 02:11 |
| crashoverride | it's a module that has a dependency on all the other video ones | 02:11 |
| fsmithred | are those grub modules you are adding? | 02:11 |
| crashoverride | so it inserts all of them | 02:11 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: yes. | 02:11 |
| fsmithred | ok | 02:11 |
| crashoverride | insmod | 02:11 |
| crashoverride | except for linux, that's implied. | 02:11 |
| crashoverride | (obviously) | 02:11 |
| fsmithred | here are the ones I added to the efi image to get rid of the error | 02:11 |
| fsmithred | efi_gop efi_uga ieee1275_fb vbe vga video_bochs video_cirrus jpeg png gfxterm | 02:11 |
| fsmithred | and I used a shotgun approach, so I don't know if all those are needed | 02:12 |
| fsmithred | and they are in addition to others | 02:12 |
| crashoverride | yeah | 02:12 |
| crashoverride | I am also using a shotgun approach | 02:12 |
| crashoverride | lemme try | 02:12 |
| fsmithred | "others" refers to all the ones for filesystem types | 02:13 |
| fsmithred | or partition types | 02:13 |
| crashoverride | did the same | 02:14 |
| crashoverride | wait | 02:14 |
| crashoverride | I didn't put that :) | 02:14 |
| crashoverride | but lemme upload my list of modules | 02:14 |
| crashoverride | in case you see different ones | 02:14 |
| crashoverride | https://wtf.roflcopter.fr/pics/lbAzX5UT/IydoZwXF.png | 02:15 |
| crashoverride | "others" isn't in the list btw | 02:17 |
| fsmithred | no, "others" means "ones that I didn't copy/paste here" | 02:17 |
| fsmithred | holy shit. Sorry, I'm not reading that. Make sure your partition types are in there. | 02:19 |
| crashoverride | I AM SO HAPPY I DID A SCREENSHOT | 02:19 |
| crashoverride | I just screenshot my manual (in the shell) insmod sequence | 02:20 |
| fsmithred | what do you mean? | 02:20 |
| crashoverride | and I reached the initramfs | 02:20 |
| crashoverride | so now... | 02:20 |
| crashoverride | I can just mount my stuff in the linux ramfs | 02:21 |
| crashoverride | which is totally okay for now, because then it can BOOT. | 02:21 |
| crashoverride | and I got past grub. | 02:21 |
| crashoverride | and that is WHISKY TIME! | 02:21 |
| fsmithred | ok | 02:21 |
| crashoverride | I'll test a few combinations | 02:21 |
| crashoverride | to see what works and what does not :P | 02:21 |
| crashoverride | but OMG I thank you so much for pointing me at the missing modules. | 02:22 |
| crashoverride | I had no idea that was the reason | 02:22 |
| crashoverride | now I can safely panic :D | 02:23 |
| crashoverride | \o/ | 02:23 |
| crashoverride | so I rounded it down :) | 02:38 |
| crashoverride | and now I could actually probably boot | 02:38 |
| crashoverride | let's try | 02:38 |
| fsmithred | cool | 02:38 |
| crashoverride | ok so I can get rid of the boot message that complains about me not having the video | 02:41 |
| crashoverride | but now with my hardened initrd, it really is stuck | 02:41 |
| crashoverride | crap... | 02:41 |
| crashoverride | and adding `debug` after the vmlinuz does not output anything more. | 02:44 |
| crashoverride | the initfs provided by alpine do not contain cryptsetup or lvm | 02:45 |
| crashoverride | mine should, but... | 02:45 |
| kiwi9 | I want to rebuild grub2 (or equivalent) to pick up another os. In the past I would just purge grub-pc & -bin and then reinstall. Can I do that with a Devuan install? | 03:09 |
| kiwi9 | My setup is EFI | 03:10 |
| crashoverride | kiwi9: are you writing in the context of my problem? | 03:11 |
| gnarface | kiwi9: there's already a tool for that. you don't have to reinstall just run "update-grub" | 03:12 |
| gnarface | (or update-grub2) | 03:12 |
| sgage | update-grub has always gotten the job done for me. | 03:12 |
| gnarface | you might need to use grub-install if you're moving to a new drive | 03:13 |
| gnarface | not sure about that though | 03:13 |
| sgage | sudo grub-install --recheck --no-floppy --force | 03:14 |
| sgage | followed by update-grub | 03:14 |
| sgage | This will have EFI boot to the system you ran it from. | 03:14 |
| sgage | Also, efibootmgr is your friend | 03:14 |
| kiwi9 | thanks guys. sorry crashoverride. new problem. going to try update grub & get the joy :-) | 03:14 |
| kiwi9 | perfect thanks | 03:36 |
| gnarface | no problem | 03:36 |
| gnarface | actually a really good piece of advice i got a long time ago for dealing with debian is that whenever you have anything at all come up, the first thing you should do is check to see if someone already wrote a script for that | 03:38 |
| gnarface | there's over 60,000 packages... they didn't think of everything but odds are they thought of whatever you are doing | 03:39 |
| Xenguy | Hah, safely panic, that's a keeper | 03:41 |
| unixbsd | is it possible to install gtk 1.2 -dev development on devuan stable?? | 09:08 |
| mason | unixbsd: You can always manually (back)port packages. | 15:08 |
| mason | unixbsd: Grab the source package, and see if it'll build, and then start modifying dependencies until either it builds or it's clear it's too big a shift to try. | 15:08 |
| unixbsd | the problem is glib to recompile? glib locks down the systm. | 15:16 |
| unixbsd | why not chroot to debian sarge with 1.2 gtk, with debootstrap (chroot and compile it)? | 15:17 |
| mason | unixbsd: Oh, sure, chroots solve any number of issues. | 15:24 |
| jonadab | For gtk1, you're going to need a lot of old dependencies. Old versions of things like glibc. | 15:38 |
| jonadab | And modern compilers have warnings for a TON of things they didn't have warnings for back then, so trying to wade through all the compiler warnings to find any actually relevant errors, is going to be "fun". | 15:39 |
| jonadab | But I don't think there's any fundamental reason it couldn't be compiled on a modern system. | 15:39 |
| crashoverride | ok, fsmithred, if I ever meet you, and I'm not in deep financial shit | 18:28 |
| crashoverride | I'll treat you to a nice dinner | 18:28 |
| crashoverride | because devuan is just amazing. | 18:28 |
| crashoverride | I never used it for work, and in general I stay away from all things linux and glibc | 18:28 |
| crashoverride | but it is just amazingly usable. | 18:28 |
| crashoverride | (also, if anyone else is to congratulate on that, I'd happily invite them too under the same conditions) | 18:29 |
| crashoverride | (unless it's like 20+ people, that can start being pricey) | 18:29 |
| fsmithred | thanks. There's around a dozen of us. | 18:51 |
| fsmithred | I haven't actually counted lately. | 18:51 |
| melodie | hello | 22:03 |
| mason | o/ | 22:18 |
| melodie | hi mason ! | 22:18 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: so, I'm having a slight issue with the power management tools | 22:32 |
| crashoverride | closing the lid of my T440p does not put the machine to suspend-to-ram as configured | 22:32 |
| fsmithred | crashoverride, are you running beowulf or chimaera? | 22:34 |
| fsmithred | it works for me in the latter only. Check the forum - there are some fixes that work for some people. | 22:34 |
| crashoverride | 3.0 | 22:35 |
| fsmithred | beowufl | 22:35 |
| crashoverride | which I think is beowulf | 22:35 |
| crashoverride | yeah | 22:35 |
| fsmithred | beowulf | 22:35 |
| crashoverride | I mean I wrote my own suspend-to-ram in C. | 22:35 |
| crashoverride | I just wanted it not to conflict with the pm utils | 22:35 |
| crashoverride | no, not sure if it will | 22:36 |
| melodie | hello crashoverride fsmithred | 22:36 |
| crashoverride | hi melodie | 22:36 |
| fsmithred | hi | 22:37 |
| crashoverride | you know what's the upside of spilling 5 bucks out of whisky on your desk? | 22:37 |
| crashoverride | s/out/worth/ | 22:37 |
| fsmithred | good cleaning agent? | 22:37 |
| crashoverride | first, yes | 22:37 |
| crashoverride | true. | 22:37 |
| crashoverride | but then, it smells good for weeks. | 22:37 |
| melodie | less to drink? | 22:37 |
| melodie | lol | 22:37 |
| crashoverride | melodie: nah I bought more. | 22:37 |
| melodie | ok | 22:38 |
| melodie | is that good whisky? | 22:38 |
| melodie | old age? | 22:38 |
| crashoverride | good != old | 22:38 |
| crashoverride | kinda like good people aren't always old people. | 22:38 |
| crashoverride | usually, the more shit you've seen, the better you behave... | 22:38 |
| melodie | it can be both can't it? | 22:38 |
| crashoverride | but for some... | 22:38 |
| crashoverride | definitely. | 22:38 |
| crashoverride | but it can also be young and very good. | 22:38 |
| melodie | is that so? | 22:38 |
| crashoverride | for example, I got an exquisite 6 years old whisky once. | 22:39 |
| fsmithred | crashoverride, I think you can remove pm-utils if you're not using it | 22:39 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: ok, but then the dialogs are grayed... | 22:39 |
| crashoverride | I don't like grayed dialogs :D | 22:39 |
| fsmithred | even the ones you don't use? | 22:39 |
| crashoverride | yeah | 22:39 |
| melodie | I wouldn't either | 22:40 |
| crashoverride | I wish there was a "don't display X" option | 22:40 |
| melodie | is there a way to do suspend when you don't have a swap partition? | 22:40 |
| crashoverride | to ram? | 22:40 |
| crashoverride | totally. | 22:40 |
| melodie | ok | 22:40 |
| fsmithred | suspend to ram, hibernate to disk | 22:40 |
| crashoverride | and even hibernate. | 22:41 |
| melodie | now is there a way to get a zram tool working in Devuan ? :p | 22:41 |
| crashoverride | you don't hibernate on the swap. | 22:41 |
| fsmithred | yeah, people have talked about using zram | 22:41 |
| melodie | I have no idea, never tried since the computer which had a cpu unable to let it do that | 22:41 |
| fsmithred | yeah, hibernate goes to swap | 22:41 |
| crashoverride | fsmithred: and what if you're swap's full? | 22:41 |
| crashoverride | AFAIK there's another file for hibernation. | 22:42 |
| fsmithred | not sure what happens then | 22:42 |
| melodie | SSD : no swap partition, let's not kill the ssd's | 22:42 |
| fsmithred | if so, I should be able to hibernate on this box | 22:42 |
| crashoverride | ssds have dram cache now | 22:42 |
| fsmithred | not gonna try it now | 22:42 |
| crashoverride | :D | 22:42 |
| melodie | crashoverride I don't know about dram cach | 22:42 |
| melodie | crashoverride I don't know about dram cache | 22:42 |
| crashoverride | melodie: it's usually not big enough to hibernate on | 22:43 |
| melodie | I have bought a 32GB Kingston SSD PATA for the old box I was telling you about yesterday | 22:43 |
| crashoverride | sorry, to fully swap on | 22:43 |
| melodie | ok, | 22:43 |
| melodie | get it | 22:43 |
| crashoverride | but if you swap just a bit, it does not touch the SSD | 22:43 |
| melodie | anyway it's very fast, so no point it doing so, I'm just curious | 22:43 |
| crashoverride | plus, recent SSDs have gotten a lot better at sustaining wear | 22:43 |
| melodie | I'll brb | 22:44 |
| melodie | crashoverride fsmithred the Devuan ISO snapshot tool looks a lot like the one at antiX and MX, though I have seen a bunch of other stuff in the config file. Are they built from the same source? | 22:48 |
| fsmithred | melodie, antix borrowed some code from refractasnapshot. | 22:49 |
| melodie | oh! | 22:49 |
| fsmithred | I think they actually used the refracta tools for some release(s) years ago and then wrote their own. | 22:49 |
| melodie | I have got used to their tools now, I like the start where the program asks if it's for redistribution or for oneself | 22:49 |
| golinux | ntix and refracta go back even before systemd | 22:49 |
| crashoverride | yeah but when you've used a tool for years, you're akin to develop something similar | 22:49 |
| golinux | +a | 22:49 |
| melodie | golinux what is ntix? | 22:50 |
| golinux | antix | 22:50 |
| melodie | ok | 22:50 |
| golinux | typo | 22:50 |
| fsmithred | you can adjust it for yourself by editing the rsync excludes file | 22:50 |
| fsmithred | and the config file | 22:50 |
| melodie | antiX was already there since several years when I heard about it first time : back in 2006 | 22:50 |
| golinux | We used to hang out on the refracta forum when it still existed before devuan was a thing | 22:51 |
| melodie | fsmithred I'll have to give a look at the rsync exclude file. When I will be using it on a more powerful machine :D | 22:51 |
| fsmithred | the default settings exclude the stuff that you don't want to share | 22:51 |
| fsmithred | like ssh and gpg keys | 22:51 |
| melodie | golinux what is refracta? a distro? | 22:51 |
| fsmithred | yes, a devuan respin | 22:51 |
| fsmithred | formerly a debian respin | 22:52 |
| melodie | so which one is older, refracta or devuan? | 22:52 |
| fsmithred | refracta | 22:52 |
| golinux | reracta | 22:52 |
| melodie | oh ok | 22:52 |
| fsmithred | I've had the project for 10 years and it's a couple years older than that | 22:52 |
| melodie | was refracta a unique one or built after Debian? | 22:52 |
| golinux | Sorry can't type and wanted to get there before fsmithred . Shouldn;t even try . . . | 22:53 |
| fsmithred | used debian repos, now uses devuan | 22:53 |
| fsmithred | lol | 22:53 |
| melodie | golinux np | 22:53 |
| fsmithred | try it, you'll like it | 22:53 |
| melodie | Devuan is amazing | 22:53 |
| golinux | Yeah, problem. | 22:53 |
| fsmithred | xfce mostly without metapackages | 22:53 |
| golinux | Yes it is. :) | 22:53 |
| melodie | fsmithred what do I need to try? Refracta? | 22:53 |
| golinux | refracta.org | 22:53 |
| fsmithred | and somewhat lighter apps | 22:53 |
| fsmithred | yeah | 22:54 |
| melodie | ok | 22:54 |
| melodie | I'll give it a try in vbox first | 22:54 |
| fsmithred | live-isos only. No debian/devuan installer | 22:54 |
| melodie | aha | 22:54 |
| fsmithred | lots of extra tools installed | 22:54 |
| fsmithred | yeah, just refractainstaller, which people seem to either love or hate | 22:54 |
| melodie | can it be rebuilt, with the same kind of snapshot tool? | 22:54 |
| golinux | yes | 22:54 |
| fsmithred | yeah, that's the whole point | 22:54 |
| melodie | so what about refractainstaller? | 22:55 |
| golinux | just what it says it is | 22:55 |
| fsmithred | you can even boot the live, make changes in the live session, and then install to disk with those changes | 22:55 |
| melodie | golinux I mean : what difference with the Devuan installer? | 22:55 |
| fsmithred | it copies the running session to hard disk | 22:55 |
| fsmithred | using rsync. | 22:55 |
| golinux | Goes pretty fast | 22:56 |
| fsmithred | debian/devuan installer installs and configures packages | 22:56 |
| melodie | that's ok, isn't it? You can choose the dest partition can't you? | 22:56 |
| fsmithred | yes | 22:56 |
| fsmithred | can't do raid or lvm with it (unless you do some stuff manually) | 22:56 |
| melodie | configures packages… so... ? | 22:56 |
| fsmithred | you can have separate /home and /boot if you want | 22:56 |
| melodie | good I never do raid or lvm | 22:56 |
| melodie | I'm not that kind of geek :D | 22:56 |
| fsmithred | configuring packages takes time | 22:57 |
| fsmithred | and if you netinstall, there's also download time | 22:57 |
| fsmithred | it will let you encrypt partitions | 22:57 |
| fsmithred | it=refractainstaller | 22:57 |
| melodie | I don't encrypt either | 22:58 |
| melodie | I'm not confident enough in the encryption tools to not damage something and then data can't be retrieved | 22:58 |
| melodie | fsmithred yes, configuring packages is huge | 22:59 |
| melodie | the day before I tried in vbox : void | 22:59 |
| melodie | no go, not stable | 22:59 |
| melodie | I tried q4os | 22:59 |
| fsmithred | were you compiling packages from source? | 23:00 |
| melodie | after almost a day it had not finished to install, was not even half there | 23:00 |
| melodie | fsmithred no I didn't | 23:00 |
| melodie | I seldom compile packages, and only in installed distros | 23:00 |
| melodie | and very small programs such as gscreenshot or FF Multi Converter | 23:01 |
| melodie | or Shake | 23:01 |
| melodie | I had installed Slax in Bento antiX, and after I almost finished having it in French it started to go to pieces and break | 23:02 |
| melodie | and wondering how I would explain simple users how to save their file in there o_0 | 23:02 |
| fsmithred | lol | 23:02 |
| melodie | lol | 23:02 |
| melodie | yes | 23:02 |
| melodie | old machine rebuilding Devuan now 22% | 23:04 |
| melodie | I guess it will take a few more hours, the cpu is going to get a good jump into the present times! XD | 23:04 |
| melodie | the targeted aim : get it under 700MB XD (wish me luck! ^^) | 23:05 |
| ShadowM00n | hello; does anyone know if any recent updates related to grub or other boot packages have been known to break anything lately? I ask because I have a system that only boots to a GRUB command line, but can be booted manually thereafter. | 23:06 |
| ShadowM00n | update-grub && grub-install does not fix the issue, either | 23:06 |
| melodie | ShadowM00n is it a hard drive or a ssd? | 23:07 |
| fsmithred | get what under 700mb? installation or making a snapshot? | 23:07 |
| ShadowM00n | melodie: technically neither. it's under hyper-v | 23:08 |
| fsmithred | ShadowM00n, remove grub-efi-amd64-signed | 23:08 |
| fsmithred | unless you need secure boot | 23:08 |
| fsmithred | or fall back to the previous version of grub | 23:09 |
| crashoverride | what, grub paid microsoft to get their code signed?! | 23:09 |
| ShadowM00n | secure boot is disabled and always has been | 23:09 |
| fsmithred | remove the signed package | 23:09 |
| ShadowM00n | attempting now | 23:09 |
| fsmithred | you'll keep the unsigned package grub-efi-amd64 | 23:09 |
| ShadowM00n | yeah, looking like it | 23:10 |
| ShadowM00n | do I need to re-run the grub updater or reinstall grub? | 23:10 |
| melodie | crashoverride me thinks the first one was Mark Shuttleworth (commercial agreement or whatever) | 23:10 |
| fsmithred | sorry, I can't remember if you do or not. | 23:10 |
| ShadowM00n | I'll run it to be safe | 23:10 |
| fsmithred | should see if update-grub ran in the terminal | 23:10 |
| crashoverride | melodie: possibly yes | 23:10 |
| fsmithred | yeah, grub-install && update-grub | 23:11 |
| ShadowM00n | rebooting | 23:11 |
| ShadowM00n | there it is | 23:11 |
| ShadowM00n | thank you very much fsmithred; I've been banging my head on this for an hour | 23:11 |
| fsmithred | yeah, it's a $prefix issue. It's hard-coded to look for EFI/debian | 23:12 |
| ShadowM00n | oh wow | 23:12 |
| fsmithred | other fix is to make EFI/debian/grub.cfg | 23:12 |
| fsmithred | other other fix is to 'grub-install --bootloader-id=debian' | 23:13 |
| fsmithred | and then the boot menu says Debian | 23:13 |
| ShadowM00n | I'm perfectly ok with removing a needless package as the solution in this case, but that is very good to know | 23:13 |
| fsmithred | It was Debian who paid Microsoft for a signed bootloader | 23:14 |
| fsmithred | years after ubuntu did it | 23:14 |
| melodie | fsmithred that's a lot of possibilities. Is that written on a wiki or doc page somewhere? | 23:14 |
| fsmithred | I think we said something about it in the original release notes. It's been a recurrent problem | 23:15 |
| melodie | how does Debian have money for that kind of thing? | 23:15 |
| fsmithred | donations | 23:15 |
| melodie | fsmithred oh ok | 23:15 |
| fsmithred | they're big | 23:15 |
| fsmithred | lots of developers | 23:15 |
| fsmithred | including some who also work for Canonical | 23:15 |
| melodie | ShadowM00n are you going to write these tips somewhere on the web? | 23:15 |
| fsmithred | it's also been discussed on the forum | 23:16 |
| melodie | fsmithred wonderful and amazing at same time | 23:16 |
| melodie | oh ok | 23:16 |
| fsmithred | brb | 23:16 |
| ShadowM00n | melodie: apparently it's already on the Web, and I didn't search hard enough, because I didn't realise it was devuan-specific. Asking here was a bit of a hail-mary on my part. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | 23:19 |
| ShadowM00n | I kind of wonder how I made it this far with it, tbh | 23:19 |
| melodie | ShadowM00n is it on the Devuan online doc? | 23:19 |
| melodie | ShadowM00n don't wonder, just send a silent thanks to your foss angel XD | 23:20 |
| melodie | also maybe you are just tenacious enough | 23:20 |
| ShadowM00n | melodie: no, I mean, why it didn't act up before. I have an ansible thing going for auto-updates, and I wonder if something marked it for automatic install or something, or if I was lucky for another reason | 23:22 |
| melodie | good luck finding out | 23:24 |
| ShadowM00n | thanks | 23:25 |
| fsmithred | it came with an update around a week ago | 23:28 |
| ShadowM00n | https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=4171 found the forum reference you mentioned, for anyone playing along from home | 23:28 |
| ShadowM00n | I see, makes sense. Gentoo had a grub update as well around the same time. Theirs disabled os-prober by default, so I guess I should've expected that there'd be odd things elsewhere too. | 23:30 |
| fsmithred | crashoverride, did you find this one yet? https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=774 | 23:30 |
| fsmithred | disabled os-prober? That's an odd thing to do. | 23:31 |
| ShadowM00n | yeah, per the ebuild postinst instructions, it was disabled "due to security concerns" | 23:32 |
| ShadowM00n | one can re-enable it by setting GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER to false in /etc/default/grub | 23:32 |
| ShadowM00n | uncertain if that's gentoo-specific or upstream, from your reaction | 23:33 |
| ShadowM00n | I don't see an obvious patch in the ebuild directory, though. This references grub-2.06_rc1 | 23:34 |
| ShadowM00n | anyway, thanks again; fighting with GRUB's always tedious. | 23:42 |
| fsmithred | on grub 2.02 here in beowulf, 2.04.16 in chimaera | 23:43 |
| fsmithred | 2.02+dfsg1-20+deb10u4 | 23:43 |
| fsmithred | that's the one that introduced the latest problem | 23:43 |
| melodie | fsmithred disabling os-prober can be handy occasionnally : ie you have your distro on an external USB SSD and you don't want Grub to remember all systems it has met with in different computers (my recent experience) | 23:44 |
| fsmithred | yeah, that makes sense | 23:44 |
| fsmithred | would be nice if it was a command-line option | 23:45 |
| fsmithred | I guess you can just use grub-mkconfig instead of update-grub if you don't want os-prober to run | 23:46 |
| melodie | what advantage does it provide? | 23:49 |
| fsmithred | what? | 23:49 |
| fsmithred | os-prober? It adds other systems to the boot menu | 23:49 |
| melodie | avoiding to run os-prober | 23:49 |
| melodie | aha | 23:49 |
| fsmithred | you already stated a good purpose | 23:49 |
| fsmithred | to avoid doing that | 23:49 |
| fsmithred | thanks for the idea | 23:50 |
| melodie | yes, if I set it to false in the /etc/default/grub and run update-grub it won't add new systems to its boot stanza | 23:50 |
| melodie | well I realized recently instead of bothering with live usb, why not real one on a hdd or ssd in a usb box meant for? (Not sure what the name is in English) | 23:51 |
| fsmithred | I've noticed that is also does not add encrypted systems | 23:51 |
| melodie | I would not know | 23:51 |
| fsmithred | an installed system | 23:52 |
| melodie | I have never studied grub 2 deeply nor it's options, I learn one thing when in need | 23:52 |
| fsmithred | knowing how to boot from grub command-line can be useful | 23:52 |
| melodie | oh yes, I've done that, long ago | 23:53 |
| melodie | I'm not sure I would know how now, I don't even have the schme in mind (hd0,1)? Or? | 23:54 |
| fsmithred | yeah, that'll work | 23:55 |
| fsmithred | you can also use tab-completion to see what's there | 23:55 |
| fsmithred | disks count from 0, partitions count from 1 | 23:55 |
| melodie | :) | 23:56 |
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