libera/#devuan/ Tuesday, 2021-06-22

systemdleteMy physical machine has nvidia video... I installed nvidia driver for xorg.  Should I be using nouveau instead?  I am noticing some disturbing issues on beowulf that I did not see under ascii.04:35
gnarfacedepends on which model of nvidia card04:37
systemdleteThis one is onboard a Gigabyte MB04:37
gnarfacecheck lspci04:37
* systemdlete pulls out manual for board04:37
gnarface "lspci|grep VGA" should show it04:38
systemdlete01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation GK208 [GeForce GT 710B] (rev a1)04:39
systemdletebtw, gnarface:  I did a complete update/upgrade on the beowulf host04:40
systemdleteso the nvidia driver will be the latest for beowulf repo04:41
systemdlete(just fyi)04:41
gnarfacehttps://nouveau.freedesktop.org/FeatureMatrix.html04:43
gnarfacejudging by the featurematrix, nouveau might be worth a try for that card04:43
systemdleteYou think I will have fewer issues with it than nvidia's driver?04:43
systemdleteIf so, I am willing to swap it04:44
gnarfacewell, it's old enough that a newer nvidia driver from backports definitely isn't gonna help04:44
gnarfacethe legacy driver might but i'm not sure it's that old yet04:44
gnarfacei'd try nouveau first04:44
systemdleteOK, thanks.04:44
systemdletebbl04:44
gnarfacebut it depends on what you're doing with it04:44
systemdletenot gaming04:45
systemdletenot bitcoin mining04:45
gnarfaceyea, then nouveau should be the most stable04:45
systemdleteJust running a few VMs04:45
gnarfaceyou get to use mesa and it's better supported than nvidia's bolt on opengl04:45
systemdletesometimes this nvidia driver seems to freeze the hardware completely04:45
systemdletewhich is really scary04:45
gnarface(by everything but some commercial games)04:46
gnarfacewhich is a strange thing i never thought i'd live to hear myself say04:46
systemdleteOK, thanks gnarface (again)04:46
gnarfacenp04:46
systemdletehave to do the change and reboot the host (just for extra sure)04:47
systemdleteoh04:47
systemdletefirmware for nvidia?04:47
systemdleteAlmost forgot to ask04:47
gnarfaceit's broken it won't help you04:47
systemdletelol04:47
systemdletegood to know... kind of04:47
gnarfacevideo decoding performance will need more cpu probably04:48
gnarfacewell04:48
gnarfaceactually i'm not sure for that card04:48
gnarfacebut that's what you lose is hardware video decoding04:48
systemdletelet me see how nouveau goes04:48
gnarfacewell, if you can get the hardware video decoding working let me know04:49
systemdleteI've got 32gb ram here -- of course the VMs use some of that too.  But I am only running a few VMs04:49
systemdletegnarface:  How would I do that?04:49
gnarfacehttps://nouveau.freedesktop.org/VideoAcceleration.html04:50
systemdleteoverall, the nvidia driver is working (like, right now for instance)04:50
gnarfaceall i know about it is on this page but i couldn't get it working04:50
gnarfacei actually switched to AMD over this shit04:50
gnarfacethey don't deprecate their damned hardware04:51
gnarfacefrom their own damned drivers04:51
gnarfacebut ymmv04:51
gnarfacethe situation is it works for some people when they add it and it doesn't work for others but they don't really know why04:51
gnarfaceit seems to be one of the parts that is persistently more difficult to reverse-engineer04:52
systemdletemaybe nvidia has each chip (card) individually keyed?04:53
systemdleteI mean, some kind of user licensing via hardware.... seems silly, but I'm wondering04:54
systemdleteLooks like the 700 series cards are working with the exception of some firmware.04:54
gnarfacewell it says compute shaders are a work in progress, as is power management, but that's the furthest they've got with any of the hardware04:55
gnarfaceand yea the firmware thing but note that it's only used for hardware video decoding acceleration04:55
gnarfacethe real problem is the power management thing because most of them default to the lowest power setting and stick there unless you find a way to manually change the clocks04:56
gnarfaceand that's a good way to burn out the card if you're not careful04:56
gnarfacea rare few models default to the HIGHEST power setting but don't do so for the fans so they can burn out rather easily if you're not careful04:56
gnarfaceand i don't know which those are but i think it's overall rare for that to be the default04:56
gnarfaceprobably none of that will matter if you're just using this to display a desktop for managing some headless VMs04:57
systemdleteI have firmware-misc installed already.04:59
systemdleteI don't see firmware for nvidia specifically -- maybe i missed it?04:59
systemdleteI think I'll go with nouveau for now05:02
systemdletebbl05:02
systemdletehmmm... now it seems to be working again05:03
systemdlete????05:03
systemdlete!!!!05:03
systemdletethe minitool bar in virtualbox was not appearing when I hovered near it (I have it set to autohide)05:03
systemdletebut now it does appear as I move the mouse toward the edge of the screen05:04
gnarfaceprobably because the compositor is rendering it in software instead of hardware now, but what matters is that it works05:04
systemdleteBut I did not do anything... except chat with you!05:05
* systemdlete is NOT superstitious, just for the record05:05
gnarfacewait, i thought you just switched to the nouveau drivers?05:05
systemdleteno05:05
gnarfaceoh05:05
systemdletehaven't gotten that far05:05
gnarfacewell that's really weird then05:05
systemdleteoh good.  We are in agreement then.05:06
systemdleteIt's weird.05:06
systemdletereally weird, as you say.05:06
gnarfacecould be gremlins05:06
systemdleteBut I have seen some really annoying problems.  One time when I was logging in to the xfce desktop, all I saw was a blank screen, mouse pointer (which I could move) but no panels or other features.  I could not get the context menu, so I had to reboot.  The only "feature" was a small dark box in the upper left corner.  But, that did nothing either.  So I rebooted.05:07
systemdleteOther times, when starting xfce from login prompt (from a console window) the whole system froze (it seemed).  I could not get alternate consoles or F705:08
systemdleteto see the desktop05:08
systemdleteIt's completely unpredictable.05:08
systemdleteI did not have this under ascii.05:08
systemdlete(other issues, to be sure, but not these)05:09
* systemdlete checks the receipt for the mainboard to see if he paid for gremlins.05:09
* systemdlete was not charged for gremlins. Can't be gremlins.05:09
systemdleteI also checked the board specs; I don't see any feature called gremlins.  Are you sure about this?   Does it come free with some cards?05:12
gnarfacehehe05:14
gnarfaceyes it comes from nvidia cards05:14
gnarfacei think they construct them out of gremlins actually05:14
systemdleteIs there a driver for gremlins?   Like maybe an AMC Gremlin (c. 1976 or so?)05:15
gnarfaceno i don't think anyone knows what drives them.  that's the problem with gremlins05:16
gnarfacethey can't be reasoned with05:16
systemdleteWhich is perfect for creating mayhem.05:17
systemdleteWell since nvidia seems to be straightening itself out a bit at a time, I'll let it be.  For now.05:17
systemdleteIf I develop other problems, I'll switch to the nouveau driver.05:18
systemdletes/develop/encounter/05:18
gnarfaceyou could have better or worse luck with other window managers05:19
gnarfacedifferences in compositing behavior could help you avoid bugs05:20
systemdletein xfce, I go into the file manager (thunar?) and enable single click to activate items.  But desktop icons don't do anything unless I double click them.05:29
systemdletenvm.  I forgot there are 2 parts to xfce05:34
systemdletedesktop single click is handled separately05:35
systemdletegnarface:  You may decide to hate me (if you haven't already).  Turns out, even though I EXPLICITLY installed the nvidia driver, somehow...06:21
systemdleteit is running the nouveau driver.06:21
systemdleteBut here is SOME good news... sorta.  I just rebooted to ascii.  And nearly everything seems normal again.06:22
systemdleteBut, it could be illusory.  I'll let you know if ascii also starts hiccuping on me with the video nonsense.06:22
systemdleteWhen I boot either ascii or beowulf, I get all the IO_PAGE_FAULT errors.  Some searching tells me to pass iommu=soft to the grub command line to eliminate these messages.06:25
systemdleteBut apparently that option is for applications that can't go over 4G06:26
gnarfacesystemdlete: you should purge all the nvidia packages if you're trying to run nouveau, then maybe reinstall some mesa ones08:06
gnarfaceyou could have a mix of nvidia and mesa opengl stuff in use, and that is known to cause undocumented weird problems08:06
schillingklausnvidia is the systemd of gpus08:08
gnarfacewell it's also a known issue that you're supposed to blacklist the nouveau driver after installing the nvidia ones if you actually want to use them, but the packages in the repo should have taken care of that automatically08:09
gnarfaceif they didn't, it's a simple thing to fix08:09
gnarfacebut if the nvidia installer script from nvidia.com was used instead it usually makes a mess you can't clean up08:09
onefangWell you can always reinstall.  Nuke nVidia from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.08:12
sca__Hello13:27
JorilHello!13:31
sca__O wow a response :) I just wanted to test if i can say something in this channel. Thanks anyway13:33
UsL"It's the only way to be sure."  Hahaha!  "Well, why don't you put her in charge then?!"16:13
userI did not see answers to my vim highlight problems/questions. Are there known improvements in devuan-distributed vim syntax highlight files? Specifically for javascript and markdown, but also in general?17:04
rwpuser, Vim is simply vim and (I would imagine) would be the same everywhere.  You might try the #vim channel.  There are 567 nicks that at this moment. :-)18:30
GyrosGeieralso, I think Devuan follows Debian here18:30
userYes, and they are all registered :)18:30
rwpWell...  we could help you get registered so you would have voice there...18:31
rwpI don't see your vim question in my scrollback range.  Perhaps ask it again?18:32
userI was registered on freenode, not again ...18:32
rwpThe channel mode flag is one of the few anti-spam actions that mostly works, which is why it is so often the choice made.18:33
GyrosGeierthe nickserv db wasn't transferred from freenode to libera18:33
GyrosGeierwell, the nickserv db wasn't even transferred from freenode to freenode18:33
rwpMost of us have been beaten down so much that we set it on our user mode too in order to avoid the spambots from shouting at us all of the time.18:33
rwpRight.  All of us were registered on Freenode at one time.  But it is all gone now.  Nothing we can do about it.  Spilled milk now.  Gone and spoiled.18:34
rwpuser, I don't use vim so won't know anything myself about vim syntax highlighting but if you ask your question again perhaps someone else will know.18:36
userGyrosGeier: it was cat'd to /dev/null18:37
userrwp: it's ok, it can wait.18:37

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!