libera/#devuan/ Friday, 2019-07-19

BeerbelottWhat would be your suggestion in order to import DNS query abilities into OpenTTD: Either an external DNS client library (ldns, although not cross-compatible as-is? Another one?) or hand-crafting a lil bit of code for the specific required queries?03:42
BeerbelottWhoops wrong channel..03:42
AEonFyrIf I'm not wrong, the general advice here regarding enabling backports is: don't because it might override something and break stuff.10:39
AEonFyrBut the Devuan instructions at Let's Encrypt specifically require backports be enabled:
AEonFyrUsing 'aptitude show certbot' and 'aptitude show certbot -t ascii-backports' I don't see a lot of differences. Versions seem to be the same.10:41
AEonFyr0.28.0-1~deb9u2 vs 0.28.0-1~bpo9+110:41
AEonFyrDepends are similar, with ascii having an additional dependancy on init-system-helpers10:41
AEonFyrIs there any real difference between them?10:41
AEonFyrAre the Let's Encrypt instructions still current (Maybe from Devuan's early days?) and everyone that uses certbot has backports permanently enabled?10:41
EvilhamCrttbot is bloated, look into alternatives10:43
EvilhamAlso: that also applied to stretch IIRC buster / beowulf don't need backports for certbot (it's still bloated)10:44
EvilhamGood options are acme-tiny,, there's a bunch more listed on LE's website10:45
AEonFyrYes, the instructions relate to stretch/ascii. I'm still on ascii server side until beowolf goes stable.10:46
EvilhamI had had issues with certbot in the past, it's a crazy huge beast, since I switched to lightweight acme clients everything works perfectly10:47
EvilhamI strongly recommend you take a look into that :-D10:47
AEonFyrAlternatives are an option, but I'm familiar with certbot, it seems to work reliably with little to no need to watch it. And I'm lazy. ;)10:47
AEonFyrWow there's a lot of clients since the last time I looked :O10:55
EvilhamYup, some are very cute and small and don't require a bunch of code to run as root11:16
Centurion_DanEvilham: do the lightweight acme clients still need to be run as root?11:49
r3bootPersonally, I do my LE with dehydrated. That just needs write access to the well-known dir11:50
r3boot+ cert dirs11:50
Centurion_Danbut that doesn't handle service reloads...11:53
EvilhamYou can add your hook that runs as root11:55
EvilhamBut the tiny clients don't need to11:55
r3bootbut, since this is unix-based, its trivial to implement that yourself ;)11:55
r3bootdehydrated -c && nginx -t && service nginx reload11:55
r3bootbam, done11:55
EvilhamMy thing has a sudo somewhere, but yeah11:56
Evilham(sudo to run as non root)11:56
r3bootyeah, sure11:57
r3bootsame here, including the correct sudo rights :) The oneliner above was more to show how trivial it is to implement restart functionality yourself :)11:57
jiefkHello All! Devuan gurus, I need your help : when I "startx" or "xinit startfluxbox", I have an error "Can't open /dev/tty0 : Permission denied" (not texto but this is the idea). I remember having stumbled across this error in the past and someone here helped me with a link to Devuan site explaining that I needed some package... But I can't for the life of me retrieve the page.12:47
fsmithredjiefk, see ascii release notes12:52
fsmithredtext version is same place where you download the isos: files.devuan.org12:52
jiefkfsmithred: Aw Thanks :) Yes that was the page :)12:55
jiefkMeh :12:57
jiefk elogind : Depends: libelogind0 (= 241.3-1) but 241.1-1 is to be installed12:57
jiefkGuess I'll have to use a display manager for now :p12:58
fsmithredjiefk, the other option is xserver-xorg-legacy and edit Xwrapper.config13:17
fsmithredor use aptitude, which might be able to resolve the deps.13:29
FatPhilI think I've found a bug in Perl/Tk - to whom should I report it?18:22
gnarfacemake sure it's not reported upstream already at debian would be my suggestion18:24
gnarfacethen maybe report it, but if it's a package that comes directly unchanged from debian, it's still up to them to fix it so you should probably report upstream too18:24
gnarfacestill, you can report to devuan as well, just don't expect similar resources to be available to address it18:25
FatPhilI have the fix!18:28
FatPhilit's not at, didn't check the (early morning) midstream debian.18:32
[exa]FatPhil: what's the bug btw? (/me curious)18:39
FatPhilexa: horizontal scrollbars don't scroll with the mousewheel18:44
FatPhilThis is what's intended:18:44
FatPhil # X11 mousewheel - honour for horizontal too.18:44
FatPhil $mw->bind($class, '<4>',             ['ScrlByUnits','hv',-5]);18:44
FatPhil $mw->bind($class, '<5>',             ['ScrlByUnits','hv', 5]);18:44
FatPhilHowever, only a few lines later, those bindings are overridden by a line that does not honour horizontal scrolling.18:45
FatPhilfix = delete those two later lines, IMHO18:45
FatPhilI've not looked at the git repo to see why the later lines were added, that might be insightful.18:46
[exa]you can probably just submit a pull request there, it's usually the fastest18:50
[exa](and then bump deb packaging)18:50
FatPhilwhere's the repo? cpan's a mess!18:53
FatPhilI've been clicking around trying to find it, as I want to see the commits. Maybe I'm just being cross-eyed today.18:54
FatPhilI might investigate some other annoyances I've noticed too - strace -e open widget is shocking/depressing depending on your point of view.18:56
FatPhilIt seems the history has no granularity at all - and also it seems like there's some really poor quality churn involved:
FatPhilin jessie, mplayer used to toggle fullscreen with BTN0_DBL. upgrading to ascii moved me to mpv which is an abomination. So I moved back to mplayer, which now now longer understands BTN0_DBL. Any ideas what changed?21:49
FatPhilPause from BTN2 also no longer works.21:51
James1138Just wondering...what issues are you having with MPV?21:52
James1138In the meantime - what about update/upgrade mplayer??
FatPhilJames1138: it might be because I've not rebooted since the upgrade, but I have too many things running to want to do that. MPV has basically taking way too much CPU and skipping/locking up way too often.22:07
FatPhilafter a reboot I will try mpv again, sure.22:08
James1138Humm... I am running MPV right now along with Vivadli browser (Chromium variant) on my T500 Thinkpad laptop  and task manager is saying that I am using less than 2% CPU at this moment. Maybe upgrade MPV.22:12
slvrDoes MPV let you use different video output backends?22:13
James1138I am using XT7-player-MPV as the front-end. Yes.22:14
slvrI wonder if it's running hot due to a 'compatible' mode being used and running software where hardware could be used.22:14
slvrI have an nvidia card, and playback went to garbage when I moved to the open source drivers. Changing vlc or xine to use a different video backend changes the cpu impact significantly.22:15
James1138NVidia maybe part of the problem. My laptop is straight Intel across board.22:17
slvrnvidia was less bad than ati, when I purchased it.22:17
James1138Here is some stuff/drivers for Devuan/Debian and NVidia -
FatPhilI don't like using non-distro versions of s/w that's available from the distro. I like being "stock".22:25
FatPhilAnd I like being "stable" too. However, I do consider backports to be stock.22:26
* cosurgi is about do dist-ubrage do beowulf22:34
cosurgianyone wants to watch? :)22:34
fsmithredcosurgi, do you have a full desktop install?22:34
* cosurgi just changed /etc/apt/sources.list to:22:34
fsmithredwith task- packages?22:35
cosurgifsmithred: hm. I don't think so.22:35
* cosurgi checks22:35
cosurgitask-* I have only: task-desktop task-english task-polish task-polish-desktop task-polish-kde-desktop tasksel22:35
fsmithredlemme check22:36
cosurgi  deb            beowulf           main non-free contrib22:36
cosurgi  deb  buster-debug      main non-free-contrib22:36
cosurgi  deb-src            beowulf           main non-free contrib22:36
cosurgi  deb            beowulf-security  main non-free contrib22:36
cosurgi  deb-src            beowulf-security  main non-free contrib22:36
cosurgi  deb            beowulf-updates   main non-free contrib22:36
fsmithredwhat's debug?22:37
slvrdunno, but I like the sound of it.22:37
fsmithredbest to remove debian repo22:37
slvrprobably true. May want to see what packages were installed from it too.22:38
slvrwhen they despam themselves back here22:38
fsmithredtask-desktop depends on desktop-base and desktop-base is not ready22:38
fsmithredmight not be a problem22:39
fsmithredoh, he's gone22:40
fsmithredgood luck22:40
fsmithredtoo many lines at once22:41
cosurgiI got banned from pasting /etc/apt/sources.list :(22:41
fsmithredmakes you look like a bot22:41
cosurgiI had to use another computer to get back in. That original IP is banned.22:41
fsmithredanyway, do you normally exclude recommends?22:41
cosurgigood question. Let me see22:42
fsmithredoh, I can fix that if I can find my notes22:42
slvrcosurgi: freenode is touchy about spam due to an ongoing attack.22:42
slvruse a paste service22:42
cosurgiI hope previous IP will get unbanned soon22:42
cosurgiok, I just disabled recommends in aptitude22:43
stiltrcosurgi: In case you weren't aware, using pastebin in the prefered method.22:43
cosurgiyeah. sorry. I was thinking only 12 lines :)22:43
stiltrNo worries. :)22:43
cosurgidoes disabling recommends in aptitude carry over to other methods of updating?22:43
cosurgi--\ Dependency handling → [ ] Install recommended packages automatically22:44
cosurgiand can you tell me if that /etc/apt/sources.list was good? :)22:44
fsmithredcosurgi, I don't know. I usually do it in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/norecommends22:44
fsmithredor 00norecommends22:44
fsmithredremove the debian repo22:44
cosurgiThis one 'deb  buster-debug      main non-free-contrib' ?22:45
fsmithredyou can comment out the deb-src lines unless you plan to build packages22:46
fsmithredor backport22:46
fsmithrednot sure if pl.mirror works any better than auto.mirror22:46
fsmithredthe country codes aren't really functional yet22:46
fsmithredand you could use instead, but the should be the same22:47
fsmithredI can un-ban by name, but I don't know if it has effect on IP address22:47
cosurginow I got banned by pasting single line :(22:48
fsmithreduh oh22:48
slvrmaybe stop pasting. :p22:48
fsmithredyou sure you got banned?22:48
cosurgiDid you mean that one? It was only for debug symbols22:48
fsmithredI just did commands to un-ban you22:49
cosurgiI got this: "cosurgi [] has quit [Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))]" (and now I must type slowly)22:49
fsmithredand I got: <Sigyn> The ban on cosurgi has been lifted22:49
cosurgithanks. Now I am here in two copies. One of which was banned before :)22:50
fsmithredtry not to confuse me22:50
cosurgihaha :)22:50
cosurgiok. I can comment out the buster-debug. I just needed one day the *dbgym packages to run valgrind on somethign.22:51
fsmithredyeah, remove the debian repo, at least during the upgrade22:51
fsmithredok, so comment it out22:51
fsmithredin case you need it laster22:51
cosurgi*dmgsym, yeah. I commented it out :)22:51
fsmithredwatch out that it doesn't try to install task-kde-desktop22:52
fsmithredI did a full kde upgrade and it was messy.22:52
fsmithreddid eventually get to work, I think. (got the desktop up)22:53
cosurgihm. I don't use kde desktop in fact. I use sawfishm + rox.22:53
cosurgiThe 'task-polish-kde-desktop' must be some leftover package.22:53
fsmithredyeah, ok22:54
fsmithredyou can autoclean after the upgrade (or before, too)22:54
cosurgiI could uninstall it maybe. But sometimes I launch it to see how the improved kde ;)22:54
fsmithredoh, kde is installed?22:54
cosurgiapt-get autoclean ; apt-get autoremove ;22:54
fsmithredautoremove is what I meant22:54
cosurgiyes, I have kde-runtime, kde-runtime-data. So it is installed, but I don't care about eventual problems with it.22:55
cosurgicommand `autoremove` ?22:55
cosurgizsh: command not found: autoremove22:56
cosurgiI though you meant `apt-get autoremove`22:56
fsmithredok, I think the worst that could happen is that conflicts might force parts or all of it to be removed.22:56
fsmithredapt autoremove22:56
fsmithredwill remove obsolete packages22:56
cosurgi upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 2966 not upgraded22:56
fsmithredor apt-get autoremove22:56
fsmithredor aptitiude autoremove22:56
cosurgiyes. done.22:56
fsmithredso, no cruft to start with22:56
cosurgiok. So I guess I'm ready for updating?22:57
fsmithredyeah, you updated the cache yet?22:57
fsmithredapt update22:57
fsmithredthen upgrade22:58
cosurgiNow I wonder how to proceed: `aptitude full-upgrade` maybe?22:58
fsmithredmaybe safe-upgrade first22:58
fsmithredI did it yesterday, I think, with...22:58
fsmithredapt upgrade22:58
fsmithredgot the new kernel with that, so I rebooted22:58
slvrapt upgrade is like apt-get dist-upgrade22:59
fsmithredno, it's like apt-get upgrade22:59
fsmithredapt full-upgrade gave me more22:59
fsmithredincluding conflicts22:59
slvrlast I checked apt-get upgrade won't update system packages22:59
slvrkernel etc22:59
cosurgihm. I've disabled recommend in aptitude, so I prefer to use aptitude22:59
fsmithredthat depends on whether you have the kernel metapackage installed or not23:00
fsmithredaptitude actually had a solution for the conflict, but I declined to see if I could do it manually23:00
fsmithredyou have backups of anything important?23:01
slvrah, metapackaging has changed a lot over the years.23:01
fsmithredlinux-image-<arch> will always give you the newest available kernel23:01
cosurgiyeah, full backups :)23:09
cosurgiwhoa, `aptitude safe-upgrade` takes time!23:10
cosurgiResolving dependencies... : open: 7288; closed: 13934; defer: 177; conflict: 146523:10
fsmithredoh yeah, I forgot about that23:11
fsmithredI got impatient and canceled it23:11
fsmithredapt or apt-get upgrade won't do that23:11
cosurgiI don't think that finding solution is possibe.23:11
fsmithredhow long has it been going?23:12
cosurgifew minutes23:12
fsmithredctrl-c then apt upgrade23:12
fsmithredsave the aptitude for later23:12
cosurgiheh `aptitude full-upgrade` also has problems.23:12
fsmithredmore, I'll bet23:12
cosurgiI will try `apt-get dist-upgrade`23:13
cosurgiHm, this one seems quite peaceful - no conflicts.23:13
cosurgi2894 upgraded, 864 newly installed, 161 to remove and 49 not upgraded.23:14
cosurgiNeed to get 5220 MB of archives.23:14
cosurgiAfter this operation, 3428 MB of additional disk space will be used.23:14
cosurgiMaybe do this one?23:14
* cosurgi checks : 8GB of free space in /var23:14
fsmithredthat's a lot of packages23:15
cosurgiI tried `apt-get --no-install-recommends dist-upgrade` and I got:23:16
cosurgiNeed to get 4885 MB of archives. After this operation, 2548 MB of additional disk space will be used.23:16
cosurgi2894 upgraded, 596 newly installed, 160 to remove and 49 not upgraded.23:16
cosurgiSo it was 300 fewer packages.23:16
cosurgiIs this the smallest amount of packages that I can squeeze out of it?23:17
cosurgi`apt-get --no-install-recommends --only-upgrade dist-upgrade` does the same: 2894 upgraded, 596 newly installed, 160 to remove and 49 not upgraded.23:18
cosurgiOK. I will do this one.23:18
* cosurgi pressed 'Y'23:18
fsmithredsounds good so far23:18
fsmithredI managed to get: You must type, "Yes, do as I say." at least once yesterday23:19
cosurgifingers crossed. Downloading will take at least 30 minutes23:19
cosurgihahah :)23:19
cosurgiyeah, that sometimes gets funny :)23:19
fsmithredmine took five hours because I kept forgetting to check it and answer questions23:19
fsmithredand because it's always slow in virtualbox23:20
cosurgiOne time I had to type some super long confirmation like "Yes, I am aware that this will break my system" or something like that :)23:20
fsmithredI've seen that one23:20
fsmithredplaying with dpkg --get-selections/--set-selections/--clear-selections23:21
fsmithred(not in that order)23:21
cosurgimeanwhile I will swith to other irc identity.23:23
fsmithredfor me, you've been cosurgi the whole time23:24
cosurgiI'll keep the other irc sessions just in case :)23:24
fsmithreduh, for auto-fill, you're cosurgi223:24
cosurgiheh, nickname has some length limit23:25
fsmithredyou fixed it23:25
cosurgiyep, apt says 35 minutes to go.23:27
cosurgiI think I will try the latest kernel too. Currently I have custom kernel 4.20, package compiled by hand.23:35
stanzwonders how to 'ping' someone..lol23:39
cosurgion irc?23:39
stanzyep..right in here23:40
fsmithredsay their name23:40
cosurgiso that he gets a beep or something? I don't think that's possible.23:40
fsmithredsee pretty colors?23:40
cosurgistanz: but this works. He will have this channe highlightes when he looks someday.23:40
stanzalready done23:40
* cosurgi just learnt about ~g filtering in aptitude: "garbage: Select packages that are not required by any manually installed package."23:42
FunkyBobcosurgi: do go on?23:57

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