libera/#devuan/ Wednesday, 2020-01-01

gnarfacehappy new year everybody00:33
golinuxThankfully it's almost over for another year.  Rinse and repeat the season torture in 9 months - that's when it starts in the US.. . .01:10
rwpgolinux, Remember.  It's always darkest just before it is pitch black! :-)01:58
yetiThe Brightest Part of a Shadow is in the Middle  >>>
se7enHappy New Year12:54
prfilserhiya se7en .  in good news conversion of M$ .FON to .bdf.sfd works nicely with fontforge12:56
prfilserworking on a port to linux - hopefully someday devuan12:58
se7enMicrosoft .FON to Berkly Distribution Frontieer .San Fransisco (?)12:58
prfilserah no the .bdf.sfd is broken. plain .bdf font works though13:02
se7enI don't know what these formats are13:13
onefangThey are font formats, prfilser may think you are someone else that was discussing this before.13:23
onefangI think it was gnarface.13:24
gnarfaceyes, it was me but i still have nothing to add16:37
FlibberTGibbethappy new year all17:54
prfilserJoe vs Volcano17:54
gnarfacehappy new year17:59
furrywolfmeh.  meh, I say.18:03
FlibberTGibbethappy arbitrary calendar digit changes to you too then, furrywolf :)19:09
frabbithi. i get an gdbus error after i logged in 4 a lxde session via lightdm:'21:38
frabbitif i want to open usb sticks i get: "Not authorized to perform operation"21:39
frabbiti installed lxde-core yesterday and then i could used usb sticks, but on shutdown i got some other gdbus error (couldnt red it) and now after boot i always cant use external devices and get this error everytime i log in...21:41
frabbitits not my computer, i dont use gui fm and other stuff, so im not familiar with these programs...21:41
gnarfacefrabbit: did you look at the release notes about elogind and consolekit being mutually exclusive?21:46
frabbitgnarface: no. what does that mean?21:47
gnarfacefrabbit: you should really read the release notes, but if you're using lightdm i think it means you need to make sure you have elogind installed and consolekit uninstalled21:48
frabbitgnarface: if i do that apt want to remove all lxde stuff too...21:51
frabbitelogind and console are installed here21:51
fsmithredwhich libpolkit packages do you have? The ones that go with elogind or the ones that go with consolekit?21:52
fsmithredtry to replace the libpolkit-backend and -gobject with the -elogind equivalents22:00
fsmithredwe left lxde out of the choices on the installation media because the polkit stuff was wonky22:01
fsmithredin other words, if you can figure out how to get everything to work right, let me know22:01
fsmithredis pcmanfm installed?22:01
fsmithredyou should be able to mount/unmount removable media with that, maybe need to add pmount22:02
frabbityes pcmanfm is installed, i have the mounting problem with pcmanfm...22:03
fsmithredare policykit-1 and policykit-1-gnome installed?22:03
frabbitCAVEAT? what can happen if i try to replace them?22:04
fsmithredmaybe reboot/shutdown in menu stop working22:05
frabbitfsmithred: only policykit-1 is installed22:05
fsmithredok, first thing to try is to add policykit-1-gnome22:05
frabbitfsmithred: shutdown already doesnt work (sorry ive forgot to tell u)22:05
fsmithredlol, ok. It might get better soon.22:05
frabbiti always have to log out and use shutdown from lightdm menu22:05
frabbitok =(22:06
fsmithredI always have a terminal open. Solves a lot of problems.22:06
fsmithredif the desktop does not want to obey you, go over its head22:06
frabbitfatalerrors: hm?22:07
frabbitfsmithred: hm?22:07
frabbitfatalerrors: (sorry failed the tab...)22:07
fsmithredwhat's happening?22:09
frabbitfsmithred: i just dont understand ur last sentences22:11
frabbitok ive rebooted now and get the same error22:12
fsmithredwhat changes did you make before reboot?22:12
frabbitinstalled policykit-1-gnome22:12
fsmithredtry removable media and then try reboot button22:13
frabbitremovable media fails too22:13
frabbitalso reboot22:13
frabbiti get error22:13
fsmithreddoes it say "stable" or "ascii" in /etc/apt/sources.list?22:14
fsmithrednext thing to try is the libpolkit-backend-consolekit-1-0 libpolkit-gobject-consolekit-1-0 with the -elogind equivalents22:18
fsmithredinstall libpolkit-backend-elogind-1-0 libpolkit-gobject-elogind-1-022:19
frabbitfsmithred: apt wnat to remove lxde stuff again then... =(22:23
fsmithredmetapackages are a pain in the ass22:23
fsmithredhow many?22:23
fsmithredyou could manually install them if it's just a few22:23
frabbitehh metapackages?22:25
fsmithredlxde is a metapackage that has nothing on its own but pulls in all the packages you might need for lxde to work22:26
frabbitit want to remove lxde-core, lxsession, openbox-lxde-session, lightlocker etc.22:26
fsmithredif you try to remove one of the packages it pulled in, it wants to remove everything22:26
fsmithredif you 'apt-get install...' those packages, they should stay.22:27
frabbiti didnt installed lxde i just installed lxde-core, obconf and lxsession.. i think22:27
fsmithredthey get marked as manually installed22:27
frabbitno it was not lxde-icon-theme not lxsession..22:29
frabbit*no it was lxde-icon-theme not lxsession..22:29
fsmithredthere's also lxpolkit. I don't know if that helps.22:31
frabbitlxpolkit is already installed22:32
fsmithredI don't know what to tell you.22:32
frabbitbut so weird after install there was no problem, only at first shutdown...22:33
fsmithredI use openbox with lxpanel, pmount with spacefm or pcmanfm, and sudo to reboot or shutdown22:33
fsmithredtry creating a new user and testing, or try deleting (moving) your user's desktop configs and log in22:34
frabbiti have all this to here, except pmount and sudo, but terminal stuff is not an option here... it need to be all clickable by mouse...22:34
frabbitfsmithred: ok22:34
prfilseropenbox needs dbus22:35
fsmithredI have clicky shutdown and reboot - added them to the openbox menu, sudo nopasswd and no verification prompt - you click and it does22:36
frabbitit locks the seesion and then freezes here after some time (im switching between computers using a vm here)22:36
frabbitfsmithred: no openboxmenu here.. to complicated... i need setup with desktop symbols only...22:36
frabbitwill try now new user...22:36
fsmithredhow do you feel about qt?22:37
fsmithredall this stuff works in lxqt22:37
frabbitfsmithred: with new user same problems...22:37
frabbitah ok is that so...22:37
fsmithrednew user won't know the difference22:38
fsmithredpoint to the icon, and so on22:38
prfilseri installed devuan for a grandma and she has had 0 problems in 19 months22:39
specinginb4 grandma died 19 months ago22:40
frabbitprfilser: so what?22:40
prfilsershe had win7 on it and thought she needed a new computer because it was unusably slow22:41
frabbitfsmithred: u suggest to replace all lx* packages with lxqt* ?22:41
prfilsernow she runs firefox, libreoffice and solitary22:41
frabbitprfilser: lol22:41
prfilsersolitaire, no problems22:41
prfilserand doesn't need to buy a new laptop22:41
frabbitprfilser: what are new laptops anyway? ;)22:42
prfilserunusable is what they are, because of keyboards with < 1mm travel22:42
prfilserVote Giant Meteor 202022:43
frabbitGiant Meteor? o022:44
fsmithredfrabbit, yes, you could replace lxde with lxqt (or another desktop)22:44
frabbitfsmithred: i try lxqt then... its the same but just a different graphics library?22:44
frabbitfsmithred: ok =)22:44
xrogaanOh, nevermind, misdread.22:45
fsmithredlotta misdread lately, too22:50
frabbitfsmithred: lxqt uses xfce wm instead of openbox?22:52
frabbitsemms bigger to me...22:52
fsmithrednot sure.22:53
frabbitinstall it atm22:53
yetixfwm4 | x-window-manager22:54
yetisay the deps22:54
fsmithredyeah, I see it running22:55
frabbitooff.. thats something different...22:59
frabbitlook and feel22:59
fsmithredconsolekit stuff should be all gone23:00
frabbitfsmithred: i need to remove them?23:03
fsmithredfrabbit, I don't know. You are in uncharted territory, starting with the unsupported desktop23:04
fsmithredthey might get automatically removed (or marked for autoremove) when you install lxqt23:05
fsmithredis this a new installation?23:05
frabbitok i installed lxqt, reboote and get no gdus error after login via lightdm, but i cant use external media and consolekit stuff is still there23:05
fsmithredI hope23:05
frabbitshould i remove them all?23:06
frabbitand reboot again23:06
fsmithred"them all" is what?23:06
fsmithredall the consolekit packages might be a good start23:06
fsmithredall of xorg and all desktop apps would not be a deal-breaker for me if I were doing it23:07
fsmithredI haven't mentioned lately how much I hate this policykit stuff.23:07
frabbitapt-get autoremove --purge *consolekit*23:08
fsmithredthat'll probably do something23:08
yetithat multiseat suff maybe was a good idea when each system hat gazillions of terminals and users23:09
yetibut today where the typical *nix has exactly 1 user?23:09
yetiwhy now?23:09
* yeti gave up trying tu undertand this modern stuff23:10
frabbitoh man...23:13
frabbitthat destroyed everything...23:13
frabbitapt-get autoremove --purge *consolekit*23:13
frabbitit removed some other packages too and if i run it again (without any packagenames) it want to remove 92 other packages... games, libs, gvfs...23:14
frabbitlol long tiome ago since i last broke a whole system23:14
yetiif yot break and fix it it really is yours23:15
frabbitsince im using my minimalized nearly terminla only system i had never such problems...23:15
yetiI mainly use the gui to get an xterm23:16
yetiok... browser and mail are gui-ish too23:16
yetitoo much html in mails today23:16
yetiI need to see mails as the sender intended it to look... so html->text hacks are no go23:17
frabbithtml shouldnt be in mail...23:17
yetiit is23:17
frabbitlol shutdown via lightdm doesnt work too now XD23:17
yetilets face reality and fight other windmills23:17
frabbityes i got an gui webbrowser too, but only because "they" broke the web...23:17
yetiwe were aginst gifs bach then23:18
yetiwe smelled what would happen23:18
frabbitnp to open images external23:18
yetilike elinks23:18
frabbitif i see a gif via lynx sxiv will display it if i tell it to23:19
frabbitwith sxiv -a its even animated =)23:19
* yeti still fights with sixels...23:20
frabbitthe 92 packages apt want to remove depnding on libpolkit-gobject-elogind-1-023:24
fsmithredthat one should stay23:28
fsmithredif you just remove instead of purge, it won't actually remove those things.23:29
frabbitfsmithred: ehr yes but...23:32
frabbitthats a problem...23:32
fsmithredwhy does it want to remove the elogind libs?23:33
frabbiti have a script to keep my system clean23:33
frabbitfsmithred: dunno23:33
frabbitit removed a lot...23:33
frabbitalso the shutdown and other commands in lxqt doesnt work anymore, even in lightdm they are no longer clickable..23:38
frabbitso its broken...23:38
frabbitthats really some point i dont like inside the gnu/linux communit ^^23:39
fsmithredwell, I installed lxqt yesterday, and everything worked23:39
fsmithredbut I did it differently23:39
frabbitfsmithred: u did a fresh install?23:40
fsmithredI chose lxqt in the installer23:40
fsmithred2.1 netinstall iso23:40
frabbiti will make a new install too of course but i dont like these choice by click install..23:40
frabbiti always install an os offline and as minimal as possible23:40
frabbitthats my base23:40
frabbiteverything else is placed on top if this then23:41
frabbiti forgot i still got the packagelist from that base system!23:41
frabbitso i do not need to make a new installation maybe23:42
fsmithredno, you could remove the desktop stuff then run tasksel and select lxqt23:42
fsmithredor you could manually mess around with it until you get it right23:42
fsmithredfresh install could possibly be faster23:43
frabbityes i prefer the manually way, i will install lxqt-core again then but if taht doesnt work i will use that tasksel thing i think23:43
fsmithredif you install without Recommends, it will help23:44
fsmithredyou can always add stuff later if you need it23:44
frabbitah... i hate this23:51
frabbitfsmithred: yes i always do it like this, except important recommends23:52
frabbitseems that i lost the list23:52
frabbiti need to install again then...23:52
frabbitmaybe i will install the same 4 this computer like i did on first install: minimal, minimal xserver and then only pekwm and pcmanfm23:54
frabbitand the other gui programs that this person need of course23:54
frabbitproblem there was that i couldnt use pcmanfm to mount external devices and that i coluld shut down the computer as non-root user from xsession23:58
frabbitalways problems with these gui programs...23:58
frabbitseems like the only stable thing in gnu/linux are terminal programs... XD23:59

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