libera/#devuan/ Sunday, 2020-01-05

cosurgiepergny: the problem started when I wanted to open 256th xterm. I recompiled xserver upping the max windows limit to 512.00:00
cosurgi(actually not just xterm, just lots of windows)00:00
cosurgiepergny: so I decided to split my stuff into several xservers.00:00
cosurgiepergny: I have pinned down to -1 these: elogind consolekit libpam-elogind dbus libpam-dbus xdg-dbus-proxy gir1.2-polkit-1.0 libpolkit-agent-1-0 libpolkit-gobject-1-0 policykit-1 gvfs00:01
cosurgiand currently I can continue my work.00:02
cosurgiwill see in the upcoming weeks if I will need anything that needs these.00:02
cosurgiactually I have plenty of pcakges installed, because I recompile stuff very often.00:04
cosurgiepergny: the best benefit is that steam games now crash only single xserver dedicated to gaming.00:05
cosurgithough recently I didn't play much, because I had to switch to nouveau about 10 months ago, due to nvidia complete freeze00:05
cosurgimaybe I will try nvidia kms someday...00:09
tuxd3vis there are package with the artwork for devuan?01:25
fsmithredtuxd3v, clearlooks-phenix-darkpurpy-theme (ascii), clearlooks-phenix-cinnabar-theme (beowulf)01:29
fsmithreddesktop-base will give you some art in grub boot and login and desktop background01:30
tuxd3vfsmithred, thanks I think I will go with  clearlooks-phenix-darkpurpy-theme :)01:31
fsmithredyou can find the desktop images in git01:31
fsmithredoh, and there are also icon sets to match the desktop theme01:32
fsmithredI think darkpurpy-icon-theme01:33
xrogaanThere has been a fork of compton ( ), active but not packaged by debian. Thoughts about integrating it to devuan?04:09
tuxd3vgolinux, thanks04:15
tuxd3vthis is the one :)04:15
tuxd3vI was making some teststs and I don't know why, but slimlock doesn't worked :S04:16
tuxd3vbut in my desktop it works..04:16
xrogaanhey, thanks g4570n :)04:35
xrogaanMaybe there is no maintainer for compton on debian?04:39
golinuxxrogaan: Feel free to provide a package for consideration.04:40
golinuxtuxd3v: Yes, that is the one.04:41
xrogaansomebody did some work already:
g4570nxrogaan: Scott Leggett
golinuxIf it's in Debian, it will be in Devuan unless there's a hard systemd dependency04:43
golinuxIn fact looks like it is!
xrogaanthat's the unmaintained compton  (0.1)04:44
xrogaannew one changed name to picom04:44
xrogaanit's a composite manager I use instead of the one shipped with xfce because, xfce's one is old with vsync issues and remains old for the foreseeable future04:46
g4570nPicom Packaging status:
xrogaanThat is, xfce 4.14 got release shortly after buster, so we won't get the update for years (maybe a bit shorter)04:48
g4570nit seems that, for now, you will have to compile this version yourself, who knows how long it takes to get to the stable Debian branch04:53
xrogaana decade,04:58
nyovanyone using s6 as init system?05:17
xrogaanI don't know what s6 is06:17
onefangs6 is an init system, that's all I know about it.06:22
golinuxnyov: skarnet gave 2 talks at the 1st Devuan conference in April.  There are a few Devuan users exploring s6.06:40
golinuxYou might want to look at this:
nyovgolinux: oh nice - any slides or such?06:40
golinuxVideos at the bottom of this page:
golinuxHe had a lot of slides in his presentation.  Not sure how they look on the video.06:45
xrogaanit's apparently well maintained07:28
cosurgifsmithred: 2nd day of work without: elogind consolekit dbus policykit13:27
cosurgifsmithred: looks like my desktop is functional! :))13:27
cosurgifsmithred: anything else that I should remove?13:27
specingcosurgi: all roads lead to Gentoo13:28
cosurgiI'm not yet sure if it's fully functional. I didn't have time to try printing, or other random stuff.13:28
cosurgispecing: I respect gentoo users. I delved a bit into gentoo config scripts. Unfortunately I prefer `apt-get build-dep something ; time dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -b -j32`.13:29
cosurgiI tried slackware gentoo and debian around 1999. After couple months of using each I decided to use debian.13:33
cosurginow it looks like I have 20-something years of experience if .deb stuff. Though I'm just a user.13:34
cosurgimy gigantic hatred towards systemd led me to switch to devuan. And that's it.13:34
cosurgiit's because systemd kept deleting hibernation image of other linux from them swap partition. The only way to stop it from doing that was to delete some obscure binary in /usr/lib, no config file, even 'nomount' in fstab coule help that.13:35
GyrosGeiercosurgi, if you like dpkg-buildpackage, you'll love pbuilder14:36
linearainsystemd sucks?18:16
Hurgotronthat's the other channel18:21
fsmithred #debianfork18:22
frabbithi. i get an error when trying to logout or shutdown on xfce: Session manager must be in idle state when requesting a shutdow21:27
frabbitive tried some sugegsts ive found via search engine but they do not work21:28
frabbitive done a default xfce installation and minimilized that from 1200+ packages to less then 50021:29
gnarfaceis something still running?21:29
gnarfacei can only guess at what21:29
frabbitthe problem must be somewhere in that xfce packages, cause i minimized the installation step by step and saved packagelists after each step21:29
gnarfaceso maybe just one package too many removed?21:30
frabbitgnarface: everything works fine except the shutdown and logout21:30
gnarfacedoes seem strange21:30
frabbitgnarface: yes thats what i think too, but of course after deinstalled xfce4* i installed everything that i need to use xfce21:30
frabbitwait a sec i need to start the other computer...21:32
frabbitfsmithred: policykit-1-gnome isnt installed21:36
frabbitand it was removed at last step21:37
frabbit... is there an alternative to it? cause there comes a bunch of packages with it... 4 example adwaita-icon-theme...21:39
fsmithredI use sudo for shutdown in some cases21:40
gnarfacefrabbit: hang on21:40
fsmithredthere are also dbus commands you can use21:40
fsmithred(unless you removed dbus)21:40
frabbitfsmithred: yeah i know but theres no sudo and it should be a button ;)21:41
gnarfacefrabbit: try "apt-get --no-install-recommends install [package name]" and compare what it will install21:41
fsmithredyou can make a button for any command21:41
fsmithred1+ for no recommends21:41
gnarfacefrabbit: although, for whatever it's worth, even i have adwaita-icon-theme and i don't have any of the rest of that shit.  it's probably harmless.21:41
frabbitgnarface: no need ive configure apt not to do this21:41
frabbitgnarface: but its still 25 other packages that come with policykit-1-gnome21:42
gnarfacei don't have it, but i also don't have a gui login...21:42
frabbitfsmithred: i can create buttons in that xfce menu?21:43
frabbitgnarface: yes me too, but its for an old lady, so i need simple to understand interface here...21:43
gnarfacefrabbit: does it have to be pretty?  try xdm instead of whatever you're using.21:44
gnarfacesee if that works better21:44
gnarfacethat's basically the only advice i can give21:45
gnarfacelook up what combinations are known to work and try different once21:45
frabbitgnarface: xdm is another dm?21:45
frabbittheres slim installed atm21:45
gnarfacea really old one without fancy shit21:45
gnarfacesometimes you can figure out what's going wrong by just installing an older alternative21:45
frabbitok... but what has that dm to do with a non-functional shutdown in xfce menu?21:46
gnarfacewhether it fails or works, the difference can be informative21:46
gnarfaceoh, it might have nothing to do with it other than certain environmental differences, like permissions or graphics handling...21:46
gnarfacethe point of the exercise i'm suggesting is to try to figure out what is going wrong21:47
gnarfacewhat you're doing should work, but my hypothesis here is that the thing you are most likely to have broken that was even remotely responsible for this was only there because of slim21:48
gnarface(or whatever dm you were using - didn't even know)21:49
gnarfaceyou could also start jacking with permissions manually21:49
frabbityay! got it! =D21:49
frabbitx11-xserver-utils was missing21:49
frabbitno it works21:49
frabbitgnarface: thank u! =D21:50
fsmithredfrabbit, yes. You make a .desktop file and put it in /usr/share/applications, and it appears in the menu. It will go into whatever sections you specify in the .desktop file. See others for examples.21:50
gnarfacex11-xserver-utils, yes i have that one too21:50
gnarfacefrabbit: no problem21:50
fsmithredthe desktop's shutdown/restart buttons are unlikely to work without all the policykit junk21:50
gnarfaceunlikely unless you run xorg as root anyway21:51
fsmithred(without the house of cards)21:51
gnarfacebut that's highly unadvised21:51
frabbitnice i minimized the default xfce installation to less then 500 packages and i thik i can minmize it more.. but im not sure about some packages, i mean if i can remove them withou ahrming hotplug usb devices, shutdown as non root etc...21:53
fsmithredfrabbit, I don't know if these commands still work:
frabbitlol ive figured out what causes the problem i have with that xrandr command in my .xinitrc that will not run on startx22:03
frabbitits the kernel 5.4!22:04
frabbitive changed to 4.14 cause i got problems with irssi since last update and now every command in my .xinitrc works fine22:05
frabbitmaybe someone remember that xrandr problem i had..22:07
frabbitdevuan stock kernel is 4.9, will it change with next stable release?22:12
fsmithredyeah, of course it will change: 4.19 is in beowulf22:12
fsmithredascii version will always be 4.922:12
frabbitfsmithred: cool =)22:13
fsmithredthere's also 4.19 in ascii-backports22:13
frabbiti dont get why the 5.4 kernel breaks the xrand comman in my .xinitrc...22:13
gnarfaceit is either a driver regression or a change in compatibility with the tool22:15
gnarfaceor maby8e a change in syntax22:15
frabbitdoes devuan recommend using only the stock kernel?22:15
gnarfacei would assume yes, as does debian22:16
fsmithredyeah, we don't have time to test other people's kernels22:16
fsmithredfrabbit, are you a long time debian user?22:17
frabbiti only used it cause i red that only versions bigger then 4.14 got patches against meltdown and spectre...22:17
frabbitfsmithred: yes =)22:17
fsmithredok, so this should be like debian was in almost everything22:18
frabbitfsmithred: i tried some other distros but always came back to debian22:18
fsmithredeven jessie 3.16 got patches22:18
fsmithredyou can check at debian security site to see which patches are in which versions22:18
frabbitfsmithred: ok so this patches were put to the kernel by debian team i guess?22:19
frabbitcause the kernel devs only put them from 4.14 above...22:19
frabbitfsmithred: ...argh!22:20
frabbitehy i didnt know this? XD22:20
plasma41frabbit: I use the linux-libre kernel with Devuan. I haven't had any issues with it.22:20
frabbitplasma41: wich one?22:20
frabbitplasma41: wich version i mean22:20
plasma41Currently I'm running 4.19. I plan to switch to 5.5 when it releases for the btrfs improvements it will bring.22:21
frabbityeah i was using always the newest since now...22:21
frabbitand it caused 2 problems i know of..22:22
frabbitbut last patch came for all versions and since then i cant use irssi without screen.. so weird22:22
frabbitno matter if i use 5.4 or 4.14..22:23
frabbiti will use stock kernel from now on22:23
plasma41I used to do that. When I started running 4.19 I decided to stick with LTS kernels unless there was a specific feature of an in-between kernel that I wanted.22:23
plasma41After 5.5 I'll run the latest kernel till the next LTS, then stick with just LTSs again.22:25
frabbitfsmithred: is this that patch:
frabbitplasma41: i dont even get why there are so many kernel versions...22:26
plasma41New drivers for new hardware mostly22:26
frabbitplasma41: yeah thats what i thought..22:26
frabbitnew drivers for my >13year "new" laptop XD22:27
frabbitive changed to t60 a few weeks ago and since then i do not need any spectre/meltdown patches, even if there werent in the stock kernel of devuan, my machine is not vulnerable22:28
* frabbit will install stock kernel again and didnt have the problem of no automatic kernel update anymore22:29
frabbitlol my irssi problem is now gone too with the stock kernel =D22:46
frabbithmm.. im wondering if that video issue i have is gone too now...22:50
frabbiti found out that it only happend with youtube videos btw22:51
frabbitother websites no matter if the video is hidden or not do not cause this issue22:51
frabbitah.. no.. this problem is still there... =(22:53
frabbitfsmithred: u have a minimal xfce too right? how many packages do u have?22:59
fsmithrednot minimal, but mostly without metapackages22:59
fsmithredcurrent (new) install has 1398. I started a week ago.23:00
frabbitfsmithred: ah ok23:00
frabbit=O thats a lot23:00
fsmithredI think my refracta isos have around 1100, and devuan desktop-live has around 140023:00
frabbitbut u probably do a lot dev stuff23:00
fsmithredI haven't built any packages on this rig yet23:01
fsmithredfrabbit, I've got over 2000 packages installed in the jessie system that I just stopped using23:34
fsmithredsome of those were just to try stuff23:34

Generated by 2.17.0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at!