libera/#devuan/ Tuesday, 2021-05-11

rwpgolinux, As a completely alternate method... Booting the debian-installer and using rescue mode allows chroot'ing into the image as root. Then can run "passwd" there too.00:16
rwpIt has always seemed odd to me that GRUB2 uses Control-X to boot...00:16
golinuxI was trying to boot an old squeeze. Can't quite remember when GRUB2 arrived.  I can remember manually editing the old grub config . . .00:21
golinuxNow it's a black box . . .00:21
golinuxAs to  chroot'ing never done that (and likely never will).  I do not like to mess much with my system.  I get is set up and dread the next time I'll have to redo everything because of hair-brained decisions upstream00:23
golinuxThis whole adventure was prompted by my finally getting it together to move on from jessie.  LOL!00:24
rwpThat's the advantage of booting the debian-installer into rescue mode, it does the chroot for you so you don't need to do anymore more than select the menu item.00:42
golinuxrwp: Thanks for demystifying that01:37
rwpI use chroot a lot.  So am pretty comfortable with using it.  But even so the debian-installer offers to to assemble RAID, decrypt partitions, to activate LVM, and everything.01:40
rwpSo even I use the debian-installer when I need to do that type of thing.  Because it does the task so much more comfortably.01:40
rwpgolinux, I don't want to admit it but I have a couple of systems still running Jessie too.  For probably the same reasons.  Upgrades after that point became problematic.  But catching up on deferred upgrades on most systems these days now.01:41
golinuxThere is also a "rescue mode" option in the grub menu which is used for . . .  ?01:45
rwpgolinux, The GRUB menu entries with "recovery mode" boot single user mode with "single" on the kernel command line.01:56
rwpSingle user mode is harder to use though, for one it requires the root password to be entered to gate entry.01:56
rwpAnd for another if the system is not booting for example then it probably won't boot single user mode either.01:56
golinuxThanks for that explanation.  i will remember it for at least a few hours.  LOL!01:58
golinux(not much sticks for very long these days)01:58
rwpI sympathize!  Especially if I have slept since then.  But it is sometimes enough to remember in general and then can go look it up or ask about it again and get a hint back about it. :-)01:59
onefangFor those hanging out for the Beowulf exim4 security upgrade, it has landed.05:40
gnarfaceif that fullofquestions guy comes back someone tell him it's: "wine winecfg"  "wine regedit" and "wine control"05:52
gnarfacewine doesn't have a gui interface of its own but it comes with a handful of builtins to supplant the native windows ones05:53
onefangThen fullofquestions will be fullofwine.05:53
gnarfacewell, probably that is inevitable though05:53
lts-Any ideas what was the cause of the delay? It is a bit scary that it took so long after buster-security had it06:36
rwplts-, Delay in which package?  I don't see anything indicative in the scrollback.06:51
lts-Sorry, I meant the exim4 about which onefang spoke a few lines above06:52
rwpThanks lts- for filling me in.06:55
rwpI have been rather ignoring the exim problems because I am not using exim anywhere.  So it just hasn't been of concern to me.06:55
lts-Not using it either, just worried that there might be something which may cause an equally important security update to be delayed in the future, about a software I do use06:56
unixbsdi try to use elvis or kilo for settings. elvis isnt into the packages.06:57
onefangExim4 is the one installed by default, so it worries a lot of people.  I don't know the details, but there was an issue with amprolla, the software we use to pull info from Debian's repo servers to put together the info for our own.06:57
lts-Thanks onefang06:57
debdogFYI regarding my pdf (passwort) issues (Ionic). found another one able to open the document: mupdf.14:36
debdogbut it also reports "warning: aes padding out of range". so the issue might not be related to the passwort at all14:36
debdogwell, the t in passwort is part of my german slang :P14:39
nawlertIt seems that xserver-xorg is broken in beowulf in it's dependencies. Now it pulls 400+mb including adawaita icon theme for some reason.16:03
nawlertan icon theme should never be a dependency16:04
nawlertit also pulled in gtk3 for some reason16:04
nawlertthat is just silly. I now have to purge gtk16:04
debdogyou prolly looking for xserver-xorg-core16:05
nawlertthank you, i will keep that in mind16:06
nawlerti had no idea that xorg was a meta package.16:06
xinomiloor maybe : apt install xserver-xorg --no-install-recommends16:07
nawlerti know that devuan is not a mirror of debian in it's repo's. But deprecating amiwm in the repos? What was the reason for that? I mean is has been working for me perfectly for twenty years.. Building it is no big deal, ofcourse.16:10
nawlertrel date:199416:11
xinomiloit's in testing/ceres, don't know why not on stable.. maybe check debian page16:11
xinomiloaha, it's actually in repos.. just in non-free16:12
nawlertoh my bad. Thank you vvery much16:13
nawlertit is the only desktop i can stand16:13
nawlertsadly most distros use the old 1998 version16:14
nawlertand not the 2010 version16:14
nawlertcool fact, it was the first desktop that made fmv (full motion video) available as a background. Ten years before windows vista =D16:17
xinomilobut why non-free ? do you know?16:17
nawlerti have no idea, it is free as in GPL on any version older than the 1998 vversions and previous16:18
nawlertbut as ubuntu uses that one (lacks so much functionality)16:19
nawlertit became the standard package.. (this is just an assumption)16:19
nawlertOh if you read the license it is gpl+ which means you can do anything at all with it. Perhaps that is why.16:21
nawlertIt is not defined as gpl16:21
xinomiloaha, ok! thx.16:22
nawlertTry it, it is hard to set it up properly, with strange a strange .rc structure. but once it is running you might never want to go back16:23
nawlertthank you, it seems the devuan package is up to date.16:25
Elio_MilanoBuonasera a tutti, chissà se qualcuno parla ITAliano qui? :)19:46
Elio_MilanoMesi fa ho aggiornato questo sistema da Jessie a Beowulf. Ed ora addio a startx -> xorg -> openbox :-(  Qualcuno è competente in materia?  Nel log utente di Xorg: "parse_vt_settings: Cannot open /dev/tty0 (Permission denied)", un classico.  Da root Xorg si avvia..19:46
fullofquestionsHow can wine claim that I have less than 2GB space while installing a program while the disk has like 90GB?20:34
tarzeau_the disk could be partitioned?20:34
tarzeau_and maybe corresponding partition only has 2gb space?20:35
fullofquestionsit is, does wine use the system partition and not the home one?20:35
tarzeau_or it's using some temproray directory where the space is going out?20:35
fullofquestionsno clue on a temp one, how could I check this?20:36
tarzeau_strace yourprogram :) and grep20:36
fullofquestionsstrace wine / grep wine? sorry I'm new to linux20:38
fullofquestionsbut shouldn't wine disk usage default to home? or even if it is at system/root there should be enough space20:39
fullofquestionsi haven't changed any setting20:39
fullofquestionsstrangest thing is I tried to continue the installation to see what happens. It filled the available 2GB, but the installation failed (probably cause it needed 2.3GB),21:06
fullofquestionsnow the space seems occupied but the files aren't there c/program files in wine21:07
DPAIf you execute "df -h" you can see which partitions are full. (Unless it's a btrfs quota, thats a different command.)21:23
fullofquestionsas expected nothing is full, besides the root partition to which i gave 11GB (is that normal?). The rest not even close.21:26
fullofquestionsI also got to the weird situation of not being able to do things as admin, while being able to do them as simple user22:10
djphfullofquestions: er,what?22:19
fullofquestionsi tried a command as root, told me I don't have permission to that location or something22:20
fullofquestionsas simple user it worked right after22:20
sgagefullofquestions: wine on my chimaera installation only puts 69 MB in ~/.wine22:23
DPAI don't think the root partition is supposed to ever be full.22:25
sgagemost of it is in /usr/lib, in various places22:25
djphideally, it's not :)22:26
sgageI can't track them all down, but there's some stuff in /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu22:26
fullofquestionsmaybe it displays as full cause it isn't supposed to be used? I gave it 11GB, (I think) I haven't touched it, and the installation, and me on linux/devuan only dates some days back:p22:27
sgagebut I can't make it work out to anything like 2.3 GB - a few 100 MB is all I can find22:28
fullofquestionsyou mean in .wine? or in general you can't give it more space?22:28
sgageI mean that when I add up all the files here and there, it comes to maybe 400 MB max.22:29
fullofquestionsmy issue was it didn't give me more than 2GB for installation, even though the disk space is huge compared to that22:30
golinuxI have a nearly 30gb root because in the past I have run out of disk space when processing video in /temp22:31
golinuxI should have used /22:31
fullofquestions /usr/ is in root right? cause mine seems to be22:32
sgageit shouldn't need anything like 2 GB for the installation.22:32
fullofquestions2GB was for a game installation (it needed 2.3 actually)22:33
sgagea game installation! I'd have thought that would go to your ~/.wine...22:33
fullofquestionsseems I've misunderstood some things, and maybe I have filled root22:34
fullofquestionsI thought root would only have the base system files, and the rest goes in home22:35
fullofquestionsbut doesn't seem so22:35
sgageyes, there are lots and lots of wine files in /usr/lib/...22:36
fullofquestionsmy /usr is full of things22:36
sgageOnly 89MB goes in ~/.wine22:36
sgageyes, /usr is full of things, that's normal :-)22:36
fullofquestionsI guess I'll have to give most of the 120GB "C" drive to the root partition22:37
sgagei use synaptic to quickly and easily show me what files a package is going to install22:37
fullofquestionschanging it with gparted now shouldn't be an issue right?22:37
sgageand where they are placed22:37
sgageI am not sure how much space you have in which partitions. All I know is22:39
sgagethat on my computer, a full wine installation puts 89MB in ~/.wine, and a few22:39
sgagehundred more MB in /usr, and a launcher in /usr/bin22:40
sgagewhere your game wants to put 2.3 GB I don't know - THAT is the kind of thing22:40
sgagethat really ought to go in ~/.wine, but you have lots of drive space in ~22:41
sgageI am really not clear on your partitioning scheme - you can run gparted22:42
sgageand see it all laid out, and maybe you can tell us.22:42
fullofquestionsyes sda1 (root) 11GB is full, half of it in /usr. Sda2 100GB has 90% empty space22:47
sgageand sda2 is a separate /home partition?22:49
fsmithredhow the hell did you fill 11GB??22:52
fsmithredgnome AND kde?22:52
fullofquestionsi'm still wondering:p22:52
fsmithredinstall and run gdmap22:53
fullofquestionsjust hedders, wine, essentials and a couple of games so far22:53
sgagehe can't, / is full :-)22:53
fsmithredlol, oh yeah22:53
fsmithreddoesn't wine go into the user's home?22:54
fullofquestionsoh and the nvidia drivers22:54
fullofquestionsyes it did22:56
fsmithredas root, run 'du -sh /var'22:56
sgagefsmithred, some of wine goes into ~/.wine22:56
sgagemost of it goes in /usr/lib/(various subdirectories) but doesn't amount22:56
sgageto more than a couple hundred MBs.22:57
fsmithredthe win programs you install are in user's home, right?22:57
fullofquestions / is root right?22:57
fsmithred / is the root of your filesystem22:57
fsmithredbut /root is root's home22:58
fullofquestionscause from / i can see a root folder and a home folder22:58
sgageI am confused.22:58
sgageroot meaning '/' or root meaning '/root'?22:59
fullofquestionsthe later leads to home/user/.wine22:59
fullofquestionswell the first disk (sda) has a display name of File System, and a path of /23:00
fullofquestionsin there, there's root, home and other folders23:00
fsmithredinside /home should be the home directories of your users23:01
fsmithredprobably just one23:01
sgagehome is sda2, right?23:01
fsmithredThe root user has a home directory that isn't in /home for reasons to do with separate partitions and booting.23:02
fullofquestionsok so since sda1 is / (11GB) and sda2 is labbeled /home (100) GB, i have set up a separate home partition as I though/was supposed to do right?23:02
fsmithredsounds like that's what you did23:02
fsmithredand it makes sense to do that23:02
fullofquestionsok there goes some of the confusion23:03
fsmithredI use 12GB in a virtual disk to create a snapshot.iso, and that allows enough room for a copy of the entire filesystem plus the iso that gets made23:03
fsmithreddu -Sh /23:04
fsmithredlook for big files/directories23:04
fsmithredor use gdmap if you want a graphical representation. (or kdirstat if you're in kde)23:04
fsmithreddid you check /var?23:05
fullofquestionsis there some command to run du -sh equivalent just on the first disk?23:05
fullofquestionscause it also searches my 400+ GB of old windows drive files23:05
fsmithrednot sure how you'd do that23:05
fsmithredunmount the other volumes23:05
fsmithreddu -sh /var23:06
fsmithreddo that first23:06
fsmithredsee if your logs are running away23:06
fullofquestionsdu -sh /var23:07
fullofquestions1.6G    /var23:07
fsmithredok, that's not the problem23:08
sgageFoQ: you had successfully installed wine23:09
fullofquestionsdu _sh /23:09
sgageand then ran out of space on / while installing a game?23:09
fullofquestionsreturned 0    /sys/module23:09
fullofquestions0    /sys23:09
fullofquestions4.0K    /target_home23:09
fullofquestions172K    /23:09
fullofquestionsplus a bounch of others in this format: 0    /sys/module , above that23:10
fullofquestionsand above those many empty lines23:10
fullofquestionsyes I run out of space while installing a game23:11
fullofquestionsthat's how this question, discussion started23:11
Jjp137hm I wonder if you accidentally ran wine as root; is /root/.wine present by any chance?23:11
fullofquestionsI tend to run many things as root to avoid being asked for extra permissions all the time23:12
Jjp137heh okay yeah that's probably why then23:12
sgagehave a look into /root/.wine. I think Jjp137 is on to something...23:12
Jjp137oh don't do that.23:12
fullofquestionsbut I guess not such a good idea after all:p23:13
Jjp137yeah only run as root when you need to :p23:13
Jjp137you don't need to be root to play games lol23:13
fullofquestionsI know23:14
sgageas root, in /root, rm -r .wine. Then reistall your game from your user acct23:14
fullofquestionsI'm just trying several things at once23:14
fullofquestionsto find how this new system works, and didn't think it would cause issues to avoid some extra actions:p23:14
sgagewine installs windows apps in the user's account that invoked it.23:15
fullofquestionshow do I replace space in paths in terminal?23:17
fullofquestionscause there's one extra folder there (game leftover) that needs removal23:18
sgageyou use a backslash to 'escape' the character.23:18
fullofquestionsand wine gave it the windows format23:18
sgageE.g., rm -r this\ is\ a\ folder\ with\ spaces23:18
sgageAlso, case matters - 'folder' is not the same as 'Folder'23:19
fullofquestionsdid it thanks23:21
fullofquestionsok time to check the rest of root for leftovers, since it's still at 9GB, thanks everyone:)23:24
fullofquestionshmm i got 0 AD through synaptic, but (at least some elements of) it exist in various folders in root23:32
fullofquestionsis that normal? Could i have caused this by being root in a terminal at the time?23:32
Jjp137that's normal23:34
sgage0 AD is a Linux program, and the executables will install in /. Only config stuff23:37
sgagewill be in your home directory. That is generally how it works.23:37
fullofquestionshmm under what folder should it be in home?23:40
fullofquestionscause i can't find it's data folders and still  / is 9GB23:41
sgagesomething like ~/.0AD, or maybe inside of ~/.config23:41
sgagewhen you install a Linux program23:41
sgagethe program code is installed in /23:41
sgageand your personal game configuration data goes in ~, usually as a dotfile of its own23:42
sgageor sometimes in ~/.config23:42
sgageyou might not see anything until you run it once23:43
fullofquestionsconfig has a 53kb 0 ad23:43
sgagerun it as user, not root!23:43
sgageshould be in the menu. what DE are you using?23:43
fullofquestionsbut can't locate .0 ad or something related23:43
fullofquestionsok maybe i've only run it as root? could that create that in root?23:44
sgagethen it puts its config in .config, which many programs do.23:44
fullofquestionsi've run it once from the menu icon23:44
Jjp137it might put other things in .local/share (Wesnoth does this, at least)23:44
Jjp137(never played 0 AD)23:45
sgagegah! don't run as root! You'll now have crap in /root which you can delete at your leisure23:45
sgageyes .local/share sometimes has stuff. what DE are you using?23:45
fullofquestionsDE is devuan? if so beowulf23:46
Jjp137oh no DE means "desktop environment"23:47
Jjp137like uh Xfce23:47
fullofquestionsdefault, xfce i think23:47
Jjp137yeah the default is Xfce so it would be in the Applications menu23:47
sgagefullofquestions: just for future reference, there is a Devuan forum:23:50
sgageSome problems are easier to work out in that format.23:51
sgageand you can get a lot of basic info.23:51
fullofquestionsmy /home/devuan/.local/share/0ad/ has 1GB of files, and in a style similar to it's windows version, but most folders seem empty23:52
sgageplay it a bit, and they'll probably get contents. I've never played it myself...23:52
fullofquestionsalso I didn't run it as root from terminal, only from the menu (but maybe I was root in a terminal at the time so that was part of the question)23:53
sgageif you are root in a terminal, it won't affect programs you launch from the menu23:53
sgagereally, use root as little as possible until you have a better sense of things,23:54
fullofquestionsyeah makes sense23:54
sgageyou can get into deep trouble - like 'reinstall the system' trouble23:54
sgageIf you have a bunch of general questions, post them on the forum.23:55
sgageThere is a learning curve for sure!23:56
sgageI started with computers in 1980, well, the 70's really. A lot of clarity23:57
sgagecomes from being sure 'who' is getting your commands, and "who" that entity23:58
fullofquestionsI prefer the more direct interaction here, but I can understand if this is getting too much for the chat23:58
sgagethinks you are at the time.23:58
sgageIt's just that for some things chat can get crazy, with questions asked and23:58
sgagenot answered, vital for trouble shooting, and it gets confusing.23:59
sgageI know that I get confuse sometimes :-)23:59

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