libera/#devuan/ Monday, 2022-01-17

micdudwondering if anyone uses nic bonding on chimaera/ceres ?01:00
wikanhmm, why there is no wicd in repo anymore?02:11
micduddeprecieated i think02:11
wikanok, thanks02:15
wikannmcli is much more powerful as i see02:15
wikanbut i have to learn it02:15
rwpwikan, wicd depends upon Python 2 and so far no Python 3 version of it. :-(02:16
JackFrostSee also: Connman, cmst02:17
rwpwikan, Most people have decided on connman as the most natural replacement for wicd.02:17
wikanhmmm, thanks02:17
wikansaved ;)02:17
wikanwell, maybe i do not need any replacement02:18
wikanis it possible to setup wifi to not connect automaticaly? just with ifup?02:18
wikani did it as "auto" in /etc/network/interfaces02:18
rrqyes. use wpagui02:19
wikani don't have gui02:19
rwpYou can do it all on the command line if you have a simple situation and it doesn't change hugely.02:19
rrqok. thereäs wpa?cli .. but I havenät used02:20
rrqok. there's wpa?cli .. but I haven't used02:20
wikanyea, right02:20
wikanso i need a script ;)02:20
rrqwpa_cli (sorry about my swedish keyboard)02:20
wikani did try it on one machine but it didn't work02:21
rrqif you have a fix setup you can add it into the iface stanza02:21
rwp scroll down to the wpa_supplicant section.02:21
fsmithredthere's setnet.sh02:21
fsmithredsetnet is in devuan experimental02:22
rwpI think wpa_supplicant is pretty simple.  Basically two steps.  1) wpa_passphrase "WPA_SSID" passphrase >>/etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf02:22
rwpAnd 2) auto wlan0\n iface wlan0\n inet dhcp wpa-conf /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf02:23
rwpThat's my usual Raspbery Pi configuration.02:23
rwpOops.  I put the \n in the wrong place.  Try this 2) auto wlan0\n iface wlan0 inet dhcp\n wpa-conf /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf02:24
rwpBut mostly just trying to focus attention on that section of the wiki page.  Since that is a long page with lots of case options discussed.02:24
micduddoes devuan  change anything to networking scripts to make them work without systemd , or is systemd in debian just a wrapper on top of those scripts ?02:29
wikani have no idea02:38
fsmithredI don't think so, but there is a package named orphan-sysvinit-scripts that contains the init scripts that some package maintainers have removed.02:38
fsmithredbut that package is in the debian repo02:39
wikanok, time to go to bed02:41
wikangood night02:41
* wikan waves02:41
micdudtrying to debug /etc/init.d/networking and ifupdown  , both seem to break if there is a bonding interface in /etc/networking/interfaces . boots up ok , with an error or two but functioning, untill you try stop or restart networking . and ifupdown does not work at all on bonding interfaces02:44
fsmithredI don't know about bonding interfaces02:44
fsmithredI know there's an unofficial patch for /etc/init.d/networking to fix a bootup delay02:45
rrq"does not work" is rather general; perhaps you can paste the setup somewhere?02:46
rrqit needs to bring up eth* to link level as well doesn't it02:49
micdudit does it automaticaly02:49
rrqwhat the doesn't work?02:49
micdudanything after bootup  , /etc/init.d/networking stop start restart , nor ifupdown02:50
micdudonly thing you can do after bootup is manual echoes to sysfs to deal with bonded interfaces , or restart02:50
rrqare you sure eth* are up automatically?02:51
micdudyes , that the way it deals with it , bonded interface automaticaly brings up slaves02:51
micdudtried it both ways , and manualy bringing  enslave interfaces and setting them to bond-master instead of enslaving rough the bond interface seems to break things02:52
rrqok. and after "ifup bond0" all looks up, with IP assignment, but it doesn't work?02:54
micdudno it works after bootup , everything is ok and has been since beowulf02:55
micdudbut trying to stop netowrking and reconfigure the bonded interface does not02:55
micdudneed to reboot everytime or manualy go trough echoes to sysfs to reconfigure everything and then manualy bring up the bonded interface02:56
rrqwell, you wouldn't stop networking, but rather just "ifdown bond0" before reconfiguring02:56
micdudifdownup errors on anything to do with bonded interrface02:57
micdudcannot up or down it02:57
rrqwhat does "ifdown bind0" say?02:57
micdudhold on , let me fire up that machine02:58
micdudifdown: interface bond0 not configured03:01
rrqhmm and "ifup bond0" ?03:02
micdudthat mainly errors out as it is trying to echo in to sysfs , but  interface was never brought down so , naturally03:10
rrqto me it suggests it expects eth* to be up at link level when bonding; but you may have tried that03:12
rrqeg "pre-up ip link set eth0 up"03:14
rrqor separate iface stanzas as manual without configurations03:14
rrqlike "iface eth0 inet manual" ... then "auto eth0 eth1 bond0" to configure them in order03:16
micdudi see , have not tied that , had them as auto and manual , but also bond-master bond0 , intstead of  bon0 enslaving them03:17
rwpI think, now that we have NM and such that grabs undeclared interfaces, that one must now declare interfaces manually or other tools will think they are fair game to use.03:17
rwpSo for example on my system with a bridged interface I have to declare "iface eth0 inet manual" to avoid other tools from trying to use it.03:17
rwpIt's been at least 7 or 8 years since I last messed with bonded interfaces but I remember using ifupdown with them at that time.03:19
rwpI think the intention is that ifupdown will work with them.03:19
micdudi had a server with beowulf and bonding , but never had to mess with it  after bootup03:20
micdudsame thing "ifdown: interface bond0 not configured"  and nothing with -v03:22
rrqright; so you added the pre-up lines and rebooted?03:25
rrqhmm quick browse suggests bonding mode 4 "is complicated"03:31
daemonhey all not 100% sure if this is the right channel to ask, but with KVM would it be possible to do this. Assuming a system with 64G of ram, I would like to setup 3 VM's each with a Max memory size of 32G (balooning), but on top of this I would also like to protect 8G of the system memory for use by the host only. I would ideally like a way to set a priority for each VM and memory requests, so that more important production boxes do not end up03:33
daemonfighting with those that are less so, with devuan as the host of course.03:33
rrqmicdud: maybe mode 6 works better?03:33
micdudit might be on switch side, but here i am just dealing with debian side of it , can switch to 6  and still have same results withouth needing to configure the switch03:33
rrq...  yeah, my random web search result suggests so :)03:34
micdud<daemon> looking trough my bookmarks ,  i remember hosts need balooning drivers install for it to work , and i remeber pinning cpus   just for guest and leaving a few for host03:37
adhocdaemon: when you hit swap becuase of memory exhaustion, performance will suck. a lot.03:38
adhocdaemon: the first rule of VMs is; Never over subscribe RAM.03:38
daemonmicdud, that should be good for the balooning and cpu pinning, any idea about reserving 8G for the host that absolutely cannot be used by the VM's and allocating memory space based on priority (dependant on which vm it is)03:39
adhocrrq: I wrote something up on bonding ethernet and plumbing VLANs over it;
daemonadhoc, it should never hit swap, the clients balooning driver simply takes up memory that is not availible to be assigned03:41
adhocyes that was for debian almost a decade ago, but it works on devuan, i tested it about a month ago.03:41
adhocdaemon: good luck with that =)03:42
adhocdid not know that ballooning was a thing on KVM, will have to look into that =)03:45
adhocdaemon: i've used swap into tmpfs on other machines, which was gnarley, but works...03:45
micdud<adhoc> vlan part  is not what i am dealing with , and bonding works  after bootup if you do not touch it , but  /etc/init.d/networking stop,start,restart or ifupdown  are broken with bonding03:45
adhocmicdud: interesting03:46
adhocmicdud: so you are tying the IP to the bond0 ?03:46
adhocthe other thing is that once a bond interface is up, with slave ethernet interfaces, you can't change it, you need to reboot and configure at bootstrap time03:47
adhocthis seems to be a thing on all debian based distros I have tried03:47
adhocno idea if that is an issue on RHEL based distros.03:47
adhocmicdud: admittedly, the instances where I use this, machines are setup and tend to run for months at a time, between patching cycles03:49
micdud<daemon> with hugepages settups  i remeber hosts would only have access  to  that portion of the memory and host would not03:49
micdudi ment guest   would have access and host would not03:50
micdudbut do not remeber if guest could share that part03:51
micdud<adhoc> interisting , reading docs  seems like ifupdown should deal with bonding , and a few bugs sugjest it was broke, but fixes since03:56
micdudi know you can manualy down it and reconfigure trough sysfs  and bring it back up manualy again ,  just wish ifupdown was a script i can read and not a binary03:57
rrqmicdud: you've probably been there, but "man 5 interfaces" tells most of the story04:16
adhocmicdud: ifdown the interface athte IP level, sure, but the underlying bond is set.04:22
micdud<adhoc> doesnt even do that just says "ifdown: interface bond0 not configured"04:23
micdudip still assigned04:23
micdudill figure it out eventualy ,  and upstream will probably say its another feature :)04:24
rrqapparently bond0 has failed during configuration (ifup) .. you maye want "ifdown --force bond0" to enforce deconfiguration actions anyhow04:24
adhocrrq: interesting, i have never got that to work. hopefully that has been fixed =)04:26
micdud--force seems to work , even de configures the bonding04:27
adhocoh nice, glad to see there is progress =)04:28
rrqI'd also guess that a "down ip link del bond0" setting could do wonders to it .. actually deleting that interface when deconfgured04:28
micdudthats what i figured i would need, some manual pre-down post-down04:29
micdudthanx guys, on the right track here now04:30
micdudthis is all for testing a new router, to up the routable/firewallable/vlans bandwith  over a canned devices that cannot cope even with linux firmware , is cpu/nic bound , so a small box with bonded nics should work04:35
adhocmicdud: your next limitation will be processes to deal with socket handling04:37
adhocmicdud: if you have ip:socket round robin on the bond, then a single stream will still tie up a single NIC04:37
adhocmicdud: else you can round robin from the linux box with a different mode04:37
adhocbut using the IP:socket streams to balance is good too, even if on stream smashes on NIC, other streams can use the other NIC in a lower latency way than some of the other modes04:38
micdudi know that  sending londbalancing is set on server for lacp , but receive is on switch side , playing with different modes on each to see which is best for  this settup04:40
micdudtrying with catalyst switches and dell powerconnects04:41
cytokine_stormrfkill blocked my wifi suddenly automatically, without any intervention. how?05:01
adhoccytokine_storm: how do you know?05:10
micdudseems that  setting interface to manual instead of static for bond0  fixes all the problems , now i can ifup and ifdown bond005:22
adhocmicdud: you want manual if you then run a bridge on top of the interface05:24
adhocmicdud: actually might be an order of operation issue05:24
adhocif you set it to manual and then post-up; ip addr ...05:24
micdudi was not there yet , just trying to get the bond to work right , so i do not have to reboot all the time to reconfigure it :)05:24
adhocoh good =)05:25
micdudis a bridge necessary for vlans ? i remeber i can just  bring them up as subinterfaces eth0.10 etc ?05:31
adhocyou can bring up bond0:005:32
adhocyou can run a bridge on the bond0 too05:32
adhocbut eth0.10 is the notation for vlans, eth0:10 for different IPs05:33
adhocif i remember rightly05:33
adhocer, I think that is the right way around05:33
cytokine_stormadhoc: wifi was working and then the network went off suddenly. then i checked rfkill and it showed blocked05:34
adhoci have an IP on the bond0 on one of the servers at work, but that is ubuntu and thus configired differently05:35
adhoccytokine_storm: can you find an event/action in your logs that shows why ?05:35
micdudthat what i usually had , for just servers and bonding05:35
micdudno vlans05:35
qwestionHi any devices can be ought preinstalled w devuan?05:50
micdudnot that hard05:51
micdudto install05:51
gnarfaceso far as i know the answer is "no"05:52
gnarfacei could be wrong05:52
gnarfaceit is really usually pretty easy to install.  you should try the live image if you are nervous05:53
qwestionmicdud: imagine wanting your whole family or neighborhood to switch06:13
micdudid setup a cloning operation , and keep it down-lo so the man does not find out06:14
qwestiongnarface: would arm image work on arm servers or something like pine64 rock64 pinephone synquacer odroid c2/c4/n2?06:15
golinuxqwestion: There are install guides with screenshots here:
golinuxAlso plenty of youtube videos06:19
qwestiongolinux: servers?06:20
adhocqwestion: i have an arm server on a rock pro 6406:21
qwestionCan it fail if stock Debian works on a device? U use same kernel, also same firmware files?06:21
adhocneed to squeeze some rotating disks in it yet06:21
adhocqwestion: depends on the device and its hardware requirements for the firmware.06:22
qwestionadhoc: I meant synquace, amd, thunderx etc06:22
adhoci recognise amd out of that lot06:22
qwestionadhoc: I meant synquacer, amd, thunderx etc06:22
adhocwhat are you trying to do ?06:22
adhocfor those ARM based systems that use an eMMC, you can get a USB adaptor, that you 'dd' an image to.06:25
adhocthen you can mount the image and adjust settings, like hostname and IP06:25
gnarfaceqwestion: embarrassingly enough, i don't think there's actually pine64 images up there yet, but i didn't have any problems building one here06:25
adhocthen plug the eMMC into the ARM system and boot it. away you go06:25
adhocgnarface: i pulled the rock pro 64 image and ran with it.06:26
adhocmight be devuan3, not 4 though.06:26
golinuxqwestion: CD1 is for server installation.  This from
golinuxserver (~670 MB): CD1 of a 4 CD set that allows for a complete off-line server/minimal installation.06:27
gnarfacearen't those instructions i386 and amd64 only?06:27
golinuxI saw a server youtube video a while ago.06:27
gnarfacethey're asking specifically about ARM06:28
gnarfaceoh, hmm, there might be links to arm instructions here...06:28
qwestionCustom kernel Debian 9 is default06:29
golinuxARM discussions here
qwestionCan I use this custom kernel in a devuan.3? Arm image06:30
adhocqwestion: depends on hardware, what is the device you want to use ?06:30
qwestionadhoc: see 2 links above06:31
* adhoc reads06:31
qwestionLikewise can I just use mobian kernel if devuan images fail?06:32
adhochonestly, that question is probably best answered in #devuan-arm06:33
adhocit depens on which aarm64 cpu and chipset is on that board06:34
adhocATX based arm64 MoBos is a good step forward =)06:35
adhocqwestion: you have browsed;
adhochmm; CPU SynQuacer SC2A11 (Arm Cortex-A53, 24-core)06:38
gnarfaceqwestion, qwestion2: you can probably boot a devuan chimaera rootfs with the kernel and u-boot from any other relatively recent distro image that is known to work for those particular boards, i just don't know off the top of my heads which ones06:56
gnarfacelike i said, i just built my own, it worked fine with the upstream u-boot and the debian source package from unstable06:57
gnarfacedebian kernel source package*06:57
gnarface5.15.2 or 5.15.5 i think06:57
gnarfaceit shouldn't be too picky though about which version06:57
qwestiongnarface: source means I need to compile?06:58
gnarfaceyea, the thing is that a bunch of the ARM builds are vendor and cpu-model specific, so it's not just as simple as one image that supports all ARM boards, or even all ARM64 boards06:59
gnarfacethe chimaera README on arm-files mentions several allwinner CPUs earlier than the pine64 one, but not the A64 that is actually in the pine64 boards, which is why i built my own06:59
gnarfaceif there's a rock64 image on there for an earlier devuan release though, that very likely might work fine for chimaera for headless servers anyway07:00
gnarfacei'm running an older kernel on several other headless machines but in most those cases also custom builds so i don't know for sure on that either but chances are very good07:01
gnarfacethe latest ubuntu image is also a likely candidate as a base image you can swap the rootfs out with too07:01
gnarfacei'm steping away again momentarily but i can help you build your own later if you still haven't figured it out07:02
qwestiongnarface: ty07:11
micdud<rrq>,<adhoc> thanx for help today08:29
systemdleteI'm experiencing occasional loss of email messages.   I have a program (bareos backup) which sends a message for various purposes.  Normally, it sends a message indicating successful completion of backups for each one of the backups I run.  But every once in a while a message does not make it to my inbox.    I have examined mail.log for one08:37
systemdletesuch instance that occurred today, and I can map the message identifiers from the log to the messages that did make it to my inbox, except for the one in question.   When I say "message identifier," I am talking about something like "20220116222708.812C5544@myhost.mynet,"  e.g.   I google searched for this question, but (once again ;( ) my08:37
systemdletesearch fu seems to be lacking.08:37
systemdleteThis is not earth-shattering, but it is noticeable, because I use the total count of messages with subject line indicating success as a means of double-checking that all my backups ran.   (I have a better way now, but it still is useful to receive these emails.)08:38
systemdletethis is all happening on devuan chimaera with postfix and dovecot-imapd.  Since I do see message logs for all the backup jobs in the mail.log, I am assuming that bareos is not the culprit.   It seems to be something to do with either postfix or dovecot (or maybe some kind of other system config issue, idk).08:40
systemdleteOh.  And I am viewing emails via Thunderbird on  a remote beowulf system via IMAP.   All emails from bareos go to the one email account on the machine hosting bareos.08:43
systemdleteI can also see the inbox using tbird on the bareos system itself.  Same situation--same missing email.08:50
systemdleteNot sure what that proves but I provide this data point for completeness.08:50
rwpHi systemdlete.  Normally I would identify the postfix message queue id for the message when it enters the system.08:50
rwpThen I would trace that queue id through the logs.  At some point it will be logged the disposition of the message.08:51
rwpSince you have the message-id you could grep the logs for it and use it to find the queue id.08:51
systemdleteI have the queue id from the mail.log.  What other log would you look at?08:51
rwpThen grep the logs for the queue id.08:51
rwpEverything will be in the mail.log08:51
rwpIn particular look for the "status=" part of the disposition.  It will normally say "status=sent" in the case of a normal transfer to another system.08:52
systemdletethe message that is missing does show up in the mail.log, and it is disposed of exactly the same as the other messages.08:52
rwpOr it might say status=bounced or other things.08:52
rwpDoes it have a "delivered to" status?08:53
rwpIn my case my local delivery will be to procmail.  So I will see something like this "status=sent (delivered to command: IFS=' ';exec /usr/bin/procmail || exit 75 #rwp)"08:54
rwpIn which case then we know the message was successfully handed off to procmail.08:54
rwpIf I needed further debug I would enable the procail log file and then look at it and trace through messages there.08:55
systemdletestatus=sent (delivered to command: procmail -a "$EXTENSION") is the last part of the last log message corresponding to the queue id08:55
rwpThen it is the same for you.  It was successfully handed off to procmail.08:56
rwpDo you have a .procmailrc file that would have rules and configuration for it?08:56
systemdleteI only use thunderbird08:56
rwpI only use mutt.  Which has nothing to do with procmail.08:57
systemdleterwp, keep in mind that nearly every day, I get mail for all the jobs.  It is only occasionally that a message is being dropped for some reason.  And it seems random.  Sometimes when it happens, only one message goes missing; other days multiple (but usually only one or two)08:58
rwpIf you don't have a .procmailrc file then it will simply deliver the mail into the default system mailbox.  Probably /var/mail/$USER08:58
systemdleteso you think it might have ended up in /var/mail$USER ?08:58
rwpI understand.  Intermittent failures are the hardest and most annoying.08:58
rwpIIRC that is the default location without a .procmailrc file.  I always have a .procmailrc file and have for so many years I don't remember the default without it.08:59
rwpBut it would do the same thing for every message.  And as you have pointed out you are getting most of your messages.08:59
systemdletedoesn't dovecot-imapd (and other imap agents) use that file to retrieve messages for MUA's?08:59
rwpDovecot wants to see the messages in a Maildir type mailbox.  Usually in ~/Maildir/ in your home directory.09:00
rwpTherefore that is where I configure my mail to be delivered.09:00
systemdleteI was kind of hoping there was a dont_drop_messages=1 that I could add to my mail config...   :D09:00
rwpHowever you said you had no configuration.09:00
systemdleteWell, certainly on my remote machine where I actually read my mail, there is no .procmailrc file in the $USER home directory09:01
rwpIs that where your mail is getting delivered to normally?  And then served out to IMAP by Dovecot?09:01
systemdleteAll the important action happens on the machine running bareos.  It just so happens that I connect to the imap server on that same machine from a remote machine where I normally look at the messages.  But as I noted above, I do not see the missing message when running tbird on the bareos machine itself either.09:02
systemdleteSo bareos, postfix, procmail, dovecot, and friends are all running on one system.09:02
systemdleteI also checked the file system sizes and space availability.09:03
systemdleteon both systems.  In particular, the /var file system where mail is kept.09:04
systemdletehold on, rwp, let me grep for the missing message queue id in the /var/mail/$USER file...09:04
rwpThe /var/mail/$USER file is an mbox format file.  It will be one file with possibly multiple messages separated by "^From " markers.09:05
systemdleteI grepped that file on both systems.  Nada.09:06
systemdletealso, rwp09:06
systemdletethis missing message is sandwiched in between two other successfully run backups09:06
systemdleteand I received emails for each of those.09:06
systemdletemay I post a short 3-liner here?09:08
rwpWhatever is happening will be something you will need to figure it out.09:08
systemdlete(don't wanna get yelled at)09:08
systemdleterwp: I know, I know...  :))09:08
rwpThe global anti-flood bot is the one that will get bad.  Do it slow one line at a time.09:08
systemdletebackup-jobA 886CE1FFE 03:06:0609:09
systemdletebackup-jobB(?) A49D41FFE 03:06:1309:09
systemdletebackup-jobC 97938255B 03:06:3609:09
rwpIs that the dovecot log?  It's not the postfix nor procmail logs.09:10
systemdleteWhat I did is make a short file with this info, copy-and-pasting the info from the mail.log.   jobA completed and sent mail at 3:06:06, and was followed by another job that finished up about 7 seconds later.   But it while it did send mail, it did not make it to procmail or soemthin09:11
systemdleteor something.  Then 23 seconds later, the next email I did receive is noted.09:11
systemdleteI am wondering if the rather close timings have something to do with this.09:11
systemdleteI think jobB is the missing one because I can't find it anywhere in my inbox or /var/log/$USER09:12
rwpNot enough information yet to know what is happening or why you are not seeing your missing message in your mailbox.09:12
systemdleteWell, I'm just saying this is the sequence of events.  I thought that might be useful for running this down.  Certainly, for my own research into this, it has been.   I just shared it with you here for edication.09:13
systemdleteclarity.  whatever...09:14
systemdletedoes procmail keep its own log in /var/log?09:14
rwpAll I can do is describe how things work normally.09:15
rwpIf a log file is enabled then procmail will log to the specified location.09:15
systemdletewhere does procmail spec its location?09:16
rwpBut you said you did not have a .procmailrc file.  (Alternatively /etc/procmailrc)09:16
systemdleteso procmail doesn't write its log to /var/log/mail.log ?09:16
rwpMost things in Unix are completely silent when they work correctly.  cp, mv, rm, none of those log to /var/log anywhere.09:17
rwpIt would help me to verify where your Dovecot thinks the mail is located: grep mail_location /etc/dovecot/local.conf09:17
systemdletebut procmail is not a command line utility either... or is it?09:17
rwpMine says: mail_location = maildir:~/Maildir:LAYOUT=fs09:17
rwpSure procmail is a command line utility!09:18
rwpprocmail also happens to be the default postfix delivery mechanism09:19
systemdlete /etc/dovecot/conf.d/10-mail.conf:mail_location = mbox:~/mail:INBOX=/var/mail/%u09:19
systemdlete(output of grep)09:19
rwpInteresting.  Yours is configured for two mailboxes.  The first is ~/mail in your home directory.  The second is /var/mail/$USER09:19
rwpUnfortunately I am not great at dovecot configuration.  I set it up here, it's working, I don't mess with it.  So I am definitely not an expert.09:20
rwpBut the above means that you will find your mail either in ~/mail or in /var/mail/$USER on your system.09:20
systemdletethere is nothing of interest in ~/mail though.  Just some empty directories reflecting some of the various accounts I have configured in tbird09:21
rwpIf it is ~/mail then that is not a default and it would need to have been configured.  /var/mail/$USER is the default though.  So I suspect all of your mail is there.09:21
systemdleteand none of those have a timestamp date past 12/31/202109:21
rwpThen ~/mail is a dead end.  We can ignore it.  That means all of your mail is being delivered to /var/mail/$USER right?  That is the default.  So no configuration ends up there.09:22
systemdleteyes, I agree09:22
rwp/var/mail/$USER is an mbox style one file with many messages.  It uses a .lock file when adding or deleting messages from there.09:22
rwpSo far nothing has indicated a specific problem with delivery there but if there is a .lock failure of some sort then possibly that could account for mail being lost there.09:23
rwpWhat are the permissions on /var/mail itself?  ls -ld /var/mail09:23
rwpMine are: drwxrwsr-x 2 root mail 4096 Aug 16 15:42 /var/mail09:23
rwpGenerally I think the recommendation is to deliver to a Maildir type mailbox and have dovecot serve the mail from there.09:24
rwpMaildir type mailboxes have one file per message.  And are constructed such that no file locking is needed for adding or deleting messages.09:24
rwpAnd unfortunately it is very late here.  I need to crash.  But perhaps the discussion helped in some small way.  Even if we still have no idea yet what is happening.09:25
systemdletesure, I appreciate it. thanks09:25
systemdleteI'll continue looking09:26
systemdletedrwxrwsr-x 2 root mail 4096 Jan 17 00:24 /var/mail09:26
systemdletenote the date though.  mine is today; yours is from months ago09:27
rwpI don't use /var/mail/rwp here.  So mine being months ago is normal.09:29
rwpIf it were me I would create a ~/.procmailrc file for you with this contents: COMSAT=no\n LOGFILE=$HOME/log/procmail.logfile\n VERBOSE=on09:29
rwpThree lines.  I joined them here.  But put each assignment on a separate line.09:30
rwpThen send yourself a test message.  See if the log file shows up.  See if it says that it did in the log file.09:30
rwpBy default DEFAULT=/var/log/$LOGNAME which is okay for your default setup.09:30
rwpIf that works then you should have some log file tracing of what is happening when mail is passed to procmail and delivered for you.09:31
rwpIf things are blown up by that then of course remove the .procmailrc file and restore things to the way they were before.09:31
systemdleteknow what?09:31
rwpNo.  What?09:31
systemdleteI was looking at ~mail on the remote system09:31
systemdletewhen I look at the ~/mail on the bareos system, it is more interesting09:32
systemdletethere are directories and files there that are recent.09:32
systemdletekeep in mind, that the mail_location I gave you is right -- it's from the bareos server09:32
rwpIf the directories have new, tmp, cur directories in them then that is a Maildir format mailbox.09:32
systemdletestrange thing though is they appear to be files containing multiple messages, not one per09:33
rwpI suspect that ~/mail will have ~/mail/{new,tmp,cur} directories in them.  Maybe.09:33
rwpIf that is true then that is the original Berkeley mbox format.  Just like /var/mail/$USER is that same format.09:33
systemdleteno new,tmp,cur in mail.  There is a INBOX and Trash09:34
rwpI am not following all of what you have said about the backup server versus your other server.  Sorry.09:34
rwpI would think that your backup server would transfer the mail to your mail server.  With SMTP from postfix to postfix.  And then your mail server would deliver it to you.09:34
systemdleteok, from here on out, I am only talking about the bareos server, where postfix, dovecot, bareos, and procmail are running09:34
rwpAnd you say you are receiving some messages.  So that seems impossible that some would be one way and some another way.09:35
rwpOkay.  If everything is on one system then that does make things simpler to think about.09:35
systemdletenot how I am doing it here.   I use imap in tbird on a remote system just to look at the mail.  No smtp going on at all in this scenario (though I do use it for other things)09:35
systemdletesorry if that was not clear09:35
rwpOnce things get to thunderbird and imap then it doesn't really matter that the client is on a different system.  That's mostly expected.09:36
rwpThe mail isn't on the thunderbird system.  It's on the server system running dovecot.09:36
systemdleteand, as I said previously, the same scenario plays out if I run tbird on the server itself.  no difference there09:36
systemdlete(right, agree)09:36
rwpBut...  It's now 1:36am for me.  I am at the end of my brain day.  If it were earlier I could keep walking through it with you.  But I must sleep.09:37
systemdletebut thunderbird may make copies of the mail messages or its headers locally on the remote system.09:37
rwpGood night and good luck!09:37
systemdletethanks again rwp09:37
systemdletegood night09:37
* systemdlete keeps talking to his rubber ducky...09:39
* wikan waves10:25
chomwittgoodmorning. I see in g++'s control file no tags. But apt-cache show  g++ will show tags. So where did apt-get got this info from?10:51
furrymcgeethere is a tags database on see alsa /var/lib/debtags or /var/lib/lists11:04
furrymcgeeI dont know if devuan has its own tags11:04
chomwittthere is no  /var/lib/debtags in my chimaera system11:28
chomwittthere is a /var/lib/apt/lists11:38
chomwittlets see11:38
chomwittif tags are a debian specific thing then how apt-cache finds tags?11:40
furrymcgeeapt update downloads the list for example
furrymcgeeplease use codesearch for sources of /var/lib/debtags
chomwitta! /var/lib/apt/lists$ emacs deb.devuan.org_merged_dists_chimaera_main_binary-amd64_Packages  it has tags!11:52
chomwittsorry for that11:53
chomwittanyway thanks furrymcgee .11:53
chomwittso when devuan creates it's Packages files it pulls info from the debian tags database?11:55
furrymcgeeaccess to the database is required to push tags for pull I would use the public released files12:01
adhocmirda: you're welcome. hope it all works out =)12:04
sabas3dghhello devuan users!15:04
sabas3dghYouCompleteMe unavailable: requires Vim compiled with Python (3.6.0+) support.15:04
sabas3dghNeed help with this ... ^^^15:04
sabas3dghfsmithred, Hello; 😄15:05
sabas3dghDo I need vim-nox?15:08
fsmithredsabas3dgh, what are you trying to do?15:16
fsmithreddid you try installing vim-youcompleteme?15:17
fsmithredit depends on vim-nox OR vim-python315:18
fsmithredoh, there's no vim-python3, so yeah, you need vim-nox15:20
sabas3dghfsmithred, installing YouCompleteMe from github. Do you say we have it packaged?15:52
fsmithredsabas3dgh, yes, it's in chimaera15:52
fsmithredmaybe more15:52
fsmithredapt policy vim-youcompleteme15:53
sabas3dghfsmithred, very much needed info; thank you sa always.15:56
sabas3dghas always15:57
pingpongballwould i know why those packages are banned?16:19
gnarfacethey either depend on systemd or they actually are systemd16:21
bb|hcbadhoc, qwestion: Did you manage to boot that SynQuacer board with Devuan?17:55
qwestionbb|hcb: no i don't have day vice yet, eval feasibility17:56
bb|hcbOK, 10x! The device looks promising...17:58
bb|hcbThey state that Debian is supported, that means that in the worst case the Debian install can be converted to Devuan18:08
rktainstalling mosquitto the install fails because /run/mosquitto is not created, mkdir solves the install problem. When I then use service mosquitto start it fails with EACCESS. How can I find out which user:group /run/mosquitto should have?19:15
wikansorry if I will enter and leave - i have network issues19:20
wikani hope so19:20
wikanerror sending C_RXON_ASSOC: enqueue_hcmd failed: -519:24
wikanis it network problem or chipset?19:24
adhocbb|hcb: no. I do not have a SynQuacer board.23:48

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