libera/#devuan/ Saturday, 2022-09-10

gnarfaceslim chance of this but can anyone sanity check my ~/.asoundrc? the 8-channel default stopped working, i assume due to a regression from a kernel update, but maybe they actually fixed something broken and my config has been wrong all along:
gnarface(interestingly, if i play directly to pcm.output or pcm.duplex all 8 channels are still properly recognized, the issue is that "!default" will only use the front two and marks all the others as unused)03:03
gnarfacesuggestions for workarounds also welcome03:05
gnarfacei already tried forcing the model as a module parameter again, no effect03:05
gnarfacemaybe there was a change to how "type plug" inherits values from the slaves or something?03:05
joerggnarface: default is "type plug" right? Isn't this an auto-adapting thing?03:13
gnarfacejoerg: yes, i've set default to type plug in this config, and i do think you're correct that it also does format conversions but i am not clear on what else i could use in this context without sabotaging dmix/dsnoop03:15
joergwhile the "duplex" combines the 8 out and 2 in, and plug trying to open it might only be able to auto-adapt to the common denominator which is two channels03:16
gnarfaceit used to work but various regressions with this driver have been common over the years, especially with regards to 5.1/7.1 channel sound03:16
gnarfacehmm, interesting hypothesis....03:16
joergit's a while since I last time looked into alsa plugin definitions03:18
gnarfaceit's kinda vague to me but i was under the impression that plug has to be somewhere in the chain ahead of dmix for dmix to work03:19
gnarfacebut i don't have all the types memorized so maybe something else would be more appropriate03:19
joergthere's one that allows splitting / routing /mixing a two real PCM into/from 8 virtual channels I think. Or you kick the pcm.duplex completely out03:20
joergooh, dmix/dsnoop are a tad "special" too iirc. plug might not be mandatory for dmix to work, but it helps a lot03:23
joergI seem to recall a `aplay -l` or `aplay -L` (also arecord)03:27
gnarfacehmm, well i liked your theory about the channel difference in input and output but commenting out 'capture.pcm "input"' from pcm.duplex has no effect on the output03:27
joerghelped me a lot03:28
gnarfaceto confirm commenting is working at all i also tried a test where i commented out the playback.pcm and speaker-test just errors then03:29
joergprobably that's the reason why it looks like this, the soundcard has only 2 ADCs aka record PCMs?03:29
gnarface(so "type plug" is still suspect but maybe not the channel difference in input and output)03:30
gnarfaceuh, how would i tell?03:30
gnarfaceoh, yes, "aplay -l" lists 2 analog inputs03:31
gnarfacei mean "arecord -l"03:31
joergthat's beyond my paygrade03:31
gnarfacenot clear on the significance of what you're saying, but you're right, 2 analog inputs, one analog output, and one digital output03:31
gnarfacehmm, i wonder if i'm supposed to be using device 2 for the input instead of using device 0 for both input and output?03:33
gnarfacewould it be likely for both inputs to be wired to the same analog jack?03:33
gnarfacedevice 0 is listed as both an input and an output, device 1 is the digital output and device 2 is "Alt Analog" input03:35
gnarfacei had assumed i think by testing that the "alt analog" input is something on the motherboard that just isn't wired to anything03:36
gnarfacebut if these inputs and outputs could share jacks, maybe they're both listening there03:36
gnarfaceit's probably relevant that it doesn't work right without the config either03:38
joergaplay/arecord --verbose : Show PCM structure and setup03:39
gnarfacedefault is clearly 2 channels as far as the driver is concerned, unless a config says otherwise03:39
joergwill give a hint what the plug pcm does03:40
gnarfaceit doesn't seem to have any effect on the output03:40
gnarfaceoh, or do you mean while actually playing or recording something?03:41
gnarface--verbose doesn't change the -l/-L output03:41
joergno, it's complementary to -l/-L03:41
joergyou should try aplay --channels=803:43
gnarfacemaybe the bug is just in speaker-test somehow03:44
gnarface  channels     : 803:45
gnarfacethis shows up in the last block with or without "--channels=8" on the command-line03:45
gnarfaceeven though the wav i'm sending in is only 1 channel03:45
gnarfacenot sure exactly how to read this but it seems like it's doing what i'd expect correctly
gnarfacenot sure how to make a 8-channel wav easily03:49
joergline 29:  Transformation table:03:50
gnarfacei have ttable in the ~/.asoundrc just to lower the center channel volume because the driver combines center/LFE wrong03:51
gnarfacei'm not clear on if it's saying it's obedient there or not03:52
gnarfaceshould be no changes except 50% volume on center and lfe03:52
gnarfaceotherwise the center speaker is double the volume of all the surrounds03:53
gnarfaceor at least was, last time this config was working03:53
gnarfacehaven't gotten as far as testing that part yet03:53
gnarfacebecause as of right now it doesn't play anything through that speaker03:53
gnarfaceyou think this could be breaking something?03:54
joergno, should output *something*03:54
gnarfacewell it's not the problem because there's no change to this state without any config03:55
joergchannel 0 (left?) from .wav to out chan 0, 2, 4*50%; 6,03:56
gnarfaceoh, shit you're onto something here03:57
gnarfacecommenting out all the ttable lines from the config, "speaker-test -c 8" now works as expected03:57
gnarfacethanks for that, that's progress03:58
gnarfacei still don't know how to apply my ttable correction without sabotaging the channel count though03:58
gnarfacethat used to work right03:59
gnarfacei'll have to do a test to see if i even need it i suppose, but i'm assuming from past behavior that i will03:59
joergtry line 43: slave.pcm "output"04:13
joerginstead of "duplex"04:13
joergshould spread input channels 0,1 to out 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7 aiui04:15
gnarfaceyou mean with ttable lines uncommented?04:17
gnarfacenah, doesn't help04:18
gnarfacehmm, maybe it's academic, because the center channel doesn't seem louder to my ears anymore04:24
gnarfaceso maybe they fixed that part04:24
gnarfaceanyway, thanks for the help joerg04:24
joergtype route, check how they do ttable for example in  (^f_ind:  ttable)04:25
gnarfacehmm, rear left seems real quiet, something may still be wrong with it04:27
joergamixer (or alsamixer) might show some hw volume controls for each DAC04:28
* joerg wonders if this is really on topic, but assuming every other distro just uses polypaudio... maybe we're on topic with alsa ;-)04:29
gnarfaceyea sorry for the noise, but nobody was answering over there04:30
onefangSounds like what you need is more noise.  B-)04:31
rrqgnarface: sox can make an 8 channel wav from a 1 channle wav.. "sox $in $out channels 8"04:35
joerggnarface: seems useful source of info04:37
rrqgnarface: and even use `play "|sox $in -t sox - channels 8"` to send it on-the-fly to the cards04:38
gnarfaceah, thanks rrq04:39
rrq(doesn't solve the ttable thingy though)04:39
XenguyGawd save the queen04:40
Xenguy(We mean it, man)04:40
joergnevermind the bollocks04:45
XenguyDon't worry about that stuff behind the curtains04:46
XenguyKeepin' it real04:46
joergI *think* the format is ttable.<inchan>.<outchan> <gain>04:52
joergfor playback. No idea if and how this translates for concurrent recording04:54
joergthe point being: I don't see how you could play 8 channels of source via a ttable.[01].[0-7] that only defines an "upstream" stereo channels 0 and 104:58
rrqmmm I understood the "type asym" of "duplex" lets it be 8 channels on playback and 2 channels on capture05:05
rrqah, now I was confused again.. yes the upstream for "default" is 2 channels..05:12
rrqnot sure how tell "play" to use "output" directly.. aybe "AUDIODEV=output play ..."05:18
gnarfaceoh hmm, yes i may have been using those ttable outputs to map stereo to 8 channels as well, for some reason that was working right before, like it was smart enough to ignore it when there were more than 2 channels? now that makes it seem curious that it would have ever worked, so maybe that's a sign i did this wrong after all05:46
gnarfacemaybe they just changed how it worked, what i vaguely remember was that it'd ignore the upstream channel setting if there was already a real channel present?05:47
gnarfacemy first test of 5.1 sound through vlc failed with utterly garbled sound (like feeding a binary directly through the audio interface raw type of sound) but after removing the config and verifying vlc works without the config, vlc still worked right after replacing the config, so that's weird05:50
gnarfacebut not bad as long as it stays working i guess05:51
gnarfaceyea they must have changed how ttable treats used channels or something05:56
XenguyAnyone else receive a sizable apt-get update this morning?  (I'm still on Beowulf here)16:04
XenguyThe following packages will be upgraded:16:05
Xenguy  eboard gir1.2-rsvg-2.0 gnome-orca grub-common grub-pc grub-pc-bin grub2-common htmldoc htmldoc-common krb5-locales libfreetype6 libfribidi0 libgssapi-krb5-2 libk5crypto3 libkrb5-3 libkrb5support0 libnet-ssleay-perl libqt5concurrent5 libqt5core5a libqt5dbus5 libqt5gui5 libqt5network5 libqt5printsupport5 libqt5sql5 libqt5sql5-sqlite libqt5test5 libqt5widgets5 libqt5xml5 librsvg2-2 librsvg2-common libwireshark-data libwireshark11 libwiretap8 libwscodecs216:05
Xenguylibwsutil9 mutt orca procmail publicsuffix python3-twisted python3-twisted-bin qt5-gtk-platformtheme tshark unrar wireshark-common16:05
fsmithredXenguy, I see 74 packages on beowulf to be upgraded. My last upgrade was mid-July.16:15
fsmithredcompared to 30 on daedalus where I upgraded three days ago.16:16
Xenguyfsmithred, I think I'm just the suspicious type, I always feel the need to ask, when I see large updates roll in  ; -)16:20
* Xenguy bites the bullet...16:21
nemodon't have anything on beowulf anymore myself16:37
nemowas pretty eager to get off it actually, had a bunch of missing goodness in terms of drivers that I needed16:37
brocashelmironically, being on ceres, i'm thinking of staying on beowulf for the sake of a less shitty xfce/gtk experience20:46
brocashelmbackports and appimages can help a bit20:47
fsmithredcan you forward-port xfce-4.12?20:47
brocashelmi have been able to downgrade to xfce 4.12 by carefully checking dependencies, but i think it would be better to use more compatible libs20:49
brocashelmit's not so much xfce as it is gtk20:50
brocashelmi purposely use gtk2 versions of programs whenever available. i keep a gtk2 version of leafpad20:51
fsmithredbrocashelm, have you tried any gtk4 yet?21:01
fsmithredI some in ceres21:01
fsmithredlosing whole words now21:03
brocashelmyeah, i have some gtk4 packages installed because of network-manager21:27
brocashelmlibgtk-4-1 and libgtk-4-common to be exact21:27
golinuxIt's worse than monkey pox21:29
golinuxA ubiquitous infection . . .21:29
brocashelmi think lxde is the only fully gtk2 DE left21:36
golinuxMaybe it should be the default going forward . . .21:59
brocashelmafaik, it's a mature product and mostly maintained by arch devs. some programs like lxhotkeys don't work anymore, sadly22:01
brocashelmlxhotkeys has been giving me an error message saying "openbox not supported right now, sorry"22:01
fsmithredis some other wm supported?22:01
fsmithredwhat is lxqt using now?22:02
brocashelmi don't think they have their own wms, but openbox seems to be suggested by default for both lxde and lxqt22:03
fsmithredI seem to recall that lxqt gave a choice of either openbox or another. possibly xfwm22:04
brocashelmthe lxqt package itself suggests obconf-qt22:05
brocashelmbut maybe it's just due to the toolkit22:05

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