libera/#devuan/ Saturday, 2023-07-15

darwinDevuan next version soon?! :D01:56
rwpdarwin, The packages are ready. It is only the installer which is still getting worked on. It is okay to install Devuan 4 Chimaera and then upgrade to Devuan 5 Daedalus.02:00
darwini need the installer though02:00
golinuxChimaera has an installer then upgrade02:01
darwini need the Daedalus installer02:01
brocashelmthere exist daedalus rc isos02:01
brocashelmpick whichever iso you need from there02:02
HakFooMy network card requires I run 'iw reg set US' in order for it to find the 5GHz network.  It seems like it works reliably when ran from a terminal, but if I make a script that calls it in /etc/boot.d, it doesn't seem to "take".  I'm not sure if it's running too late, or there's a preferrable place to set this that it's conflicting07:34
rrqI would guess it needs to run before the network adapter is brought up but after that the file system is available07:46
rrqif you use ifupdown you could use pre-up startement in /etc/netwrk/interfaces07:47
gnarfacei think you're just supposed to put REGDOMAIN=US in /etc/default/crda but i'm not sure if it actually works08:28
rwp+1.  That's the way.  That's what I do.08:40
[-_-]is it possible to install devuan from within a unix system?14:14
gnarfacehmm, like in a chroot with debootstrap? probably, though i don't know how difficult it would be14:43
gnarfacewhich unix do you mean? BSD? Solaris?14:43
gnarfacenot sure that's technically any more of a unix than any other linux distro but i'd bet it'll work14:45
gnarfaceshould work on anything you can get devuan's debootstrap running on14:46
gnarfaceor in qemu14:46
[-_-]what do I use in place of it?14:46
rustyaxedebootstrap and a bit of manual tasks will get it sorted14:56
rustyaxeYou wont have the installer to set hostname, edit fstab, create users/passwords, and setup bootloader14:57
rustyaxeIf you do those things, it works14:57
[-_-]I have run into some problem, with TERM variable15:05
[-_-]I set it to the variable inside chroot as in my own config15:05
[-_-]but I think it needs some more definitions15:05
[-_-]what can I do?15:05
[-_-]my TERM=st-256color15:06
[-_-]it is working now15:08
[-_-]after installing ncurses-term15:08
[-_-]guys, do you use network manager ?15:33
[-_-]or smth else?15:33
[-_-]for tui / cmdline interface ?15:33
[-_-]wanna connect to wifi15:34
gnarfaceusually i just write the config into /etc/network/interfaces directly, but network-manager should work15:38
[-_-]directly! wow15:38
[-_-]"W: /sbin/fsck.btrfs doesn't exist, can't install to initramfs"15:50
[-_-]is this a problem ?15:50
rrqinstall btrfs-progs15:52
rrqin the chroot15:52
rustyaxeLinux is like a swiss army knife, with no plastic surrounding its thousands of blades.. Add a little duct tape or such and you can do a lot with it. :P15:58
[-_-]Ha, boot was successful16:05
[-_-]cheers guys16:05
gnarface[-_-]: it was mentioned to me while you were offline that you can also hit up the mailing list for daedalus installer bug discussions16:07
[-_-]which init do you use?16:13
[-_-]why you wouldn't use openrc? or runit?16:15
[-_-]is this offtopic?16:15
gnarfacea little. i would use openrc if it was the default probably, but i like sysvinit better16:16
gnarfacestill, openrc is also very good16:16
gnarfacerunit i seem to remember having one or two bad experiences with discovering it missing features, but that was some time ago and i'm sure it's fine as an init system16:16
gnarfacethe primary benefit of sysvinit is that it's the one that's had the most work put into it16:17
gnarfaceso it's best supported, most reliable, etc16:17
gnarfacethe others are probably fine but you'll run into the "have to write your own init script" problem more often16:17
[-_-]haha, are sysvinit scripts like bash? I heard openrc ones are like bash16:18
gnarfaceyes, they're "like bash"16:18
gnarfacesome of them are actually bash in fact16:18
gnarface(but you're supposed to just make them generic sh)16:18
[-_-]I am trying to move to "not-systemd" cause I faced some issues with systemd, like previously a unit used to work, but now doesn't, things work that don't make sense because it violates the order of things imo, yet those scripts work as expected, and no one knows why16:19
gnarfacesh and bash are very similar, but bash has some extra features. it's considered bad form to use them in startup scripts though.16:19
gnarface(but on your own systems do what ever you like)16:20
[-_-] worries, I don't know much bash16:20
[-_-]will use shellcheck16:20
[-_-]also, in my system, there is a ghost unit file, that file don't exist anywhere yet systemd says its there16:21
[-_-]yet can't show its contents16:21
[-_-]lemme check if its still there16:21
golinux[-_-]:  Note that openrc uses sysvinit scripts16:22
golinuxOf course you can also write your own . . .16:23
[-_-]are those sysvinit specific or generic sh ones coming with sysvinit16:23
golinuxI have no idea.16:23
golinuxI bet gnarface does though.16:23
golinuxopenrc is set up that way by default16:24
[-_-]here is the ghost file of systemd :
[-_-]it can't cat it, yet says it is there, and active16:24
* golinux wonders if gnarface will even click on that link16:24
golinuxAnyway . . . tome for food . . .16:25
golinuxHa! time16:25
[-_-]aight, thanks16:25
gnarface[-_-]: yea, not clicking on that sorry. to be clear, the "sysvinit specific" scripts are also written in "generic sh" by policy. those the same thing.16:33
[-_-]nice, no need to see that link, it is not important16:34
onefangWhen I wrote my own LSB compatible sysvinit, it didn't care what language was used for the init "scripts".  I even wrote some in C.16:34
gnarfaceyes write them in whatever you feel like16:35
gnarfacesh is just the tradition16:35
* [-_-] loading commonlisp16:35
gnarfacethey could probably be php if you wanted16:35
[-_-]anyhow, how do I change to openrc /16:35
sixwheeledbeast^that is says the unit exists but needs reloading.16:35
gnarfaceyou just install openrc16:35
[-_-]sixwheeledbeast^: file of that unit no longer exits, find can't find it as root, I even tried regex to find anything that even remotely resembles that file, and found the backups my vim creates everytime I edit any file, but those are in my backup folder, so that unit file don't exit16:37
[-_-]yet it has been loaded and is active16:38
sixwheeledbeast^systemd issues are not ontopic but the daemon has to be reloaded if you change stuff like that.16:38
sixwheeledbeast^is all I'll say16:39
[-_-]it has been like this for more than one year, there is nothing to do, I only said that as a story16:40
* [-_-] 's reason for trying to avoid systemdd16:40
[-_-]onefang: what is LSB ?16:43
[-_-]got it16:44
* [-_-] rebooting16:48
[-_-]guys, we have a situation16:58
[-_-]openrc-init is stuck at that statge16:58
[-_-]I had to use ctrl-alt-del to reboot out of it16:59
gnarface[-_-]: there's instructions somewhere around here, probably just need to add or remove a package17:05
rustyaxe whats this about? Seeing a bunch of smart error log increased messages; nvme error-log output in the paste.18:18
rustyaxefor a minute i was freaking out thinking my nvme was leaking out the magic smokes18:19
onefangSounds like a class of kernel errors that's been annoying me for some time.  Tracking them down always ends with "Not a problem, really" except they fill up my log files.  Think that's one of them.18:20
onefang"Device: /dev/nvme0, number of Error Log entries increased from 3955514 to 3955694"18:21
rustyaxeja bloody annoying as it trips automated alarms elsewhere that SMS me to alert of a pending failure that doesnt exist ;(18:22
Guest1167why $XDG_DATA_HOME is not set in Devuan 5 ?18:59
Guest1167actually my main problem is why awesome wont display a app menu. And after websearching i ended reading about XDG spec19:00
gnarfacejust guessing but it probably get set if you install the right thing19:05
gnarfaceor it's superseded by one of the other XDG environment variables perhaps19:06
onefangI switched to awesome this week, it showed the app menu.  The problem was it would only show the last screenful of my "sound & video" menu, which has more than a screenful.  For that and other reasons I got rid of that and stuck with lxpanel.19:06
Guest1167lxpanel? one moment to check that19:06
Guest1167xmm. nice.. lxpanel sat at the bottom of my workspace giving me a basic taskbar ..19:08
onefangYou can add other things to it to.  I don't need awesome's top bar at all.19:10
Guest1167onefang, well. that's an idea. to remove the topbar and if i can combile LXD appmenu and taskbar with awesome.19:13
onefangMy lxpanel has - app menu, keyboard indicators (my keyboard has none), various other monitoring type widgets, systray, taskbar, clock with popup calendar, and an application launcher bar (icons for apps I use a lot).19:17
Guest1167i guess awesome could give you that if you have time to find and setup the right extensions.19:27
Guest1167anyway when various partie's X clients start sharing the desktop is interesting to find out when that co-habiting is going happily or hell breaks loose :-)19:29
Guest1167in that case awesome claims to be just a window manager. so i guess it could even come without a taskbar19:30
onefangI call awesome a window manager construction set, that uses Lua.  I really like Lua for that sort of thing.19:30
Guest1167or call it desktop-panel19:31
onefangBut I already had lxpanel setup the way I like it, and getting awesome's thing to do the same was taking too long.  lol19:31
[-_-]say I have an encrypted home partition, how can I mount it at login, any suggestions ?19:32
Guest1167so do you find the desktop panel as a facility out of awesome's projects area?19:32
Guest1167<[-_-]> how about fstab ?19:34
grayrockluks encrypted?19:34
[-_-]aight, but I only wanna put the password once19:34
grayrock[-_-]: did you use cryptsetup to encrypt it?19:39
grayrockif you mount the encrypted partition to /home in fstab, does it prompt you for a password?19:41
grayrockif not, i can tell you how to write a script to do it.19:42
[-_-]I have not tried this, but there is no way to tell from outside that the partition is encrypted19:46
[-_-]I don't think it is gonna ask for password, also I would be referring to the lvm partition, not the actual filesystem, idk how kernel treats them, are they the same?19:46
[-_-]lemme reboot and see19:47
grayrockif it doesn't you can use: cryptsetup luksOpen UUID="<whatever>" <somename> && mount /dev/mapper/<somename> /home19:50
grayrockor you don't have to use a uuid if you don't want to, just a partition name.19:51
onefangYou'll have to repeat that after they come back from rebooting.19:52
onefangWhich they just did.  lol19:52
grayrockoh, ok19:52
[-_-]yup, it tried to read the lvm partition as is, wait, don't have to repeat19:52
[-_-]I can see the logs19:52
grayrockdid it prompt for the password?19:53
grayrock[-_-]: if not, use this: cryptsetup luksOpen UUID="<whatever>" <somename> && mount /dev/mapper/<somename> /home19:54
[-_-]grayrock: no it did not, it has no idea what is there19:54
grayrockok, you can put the line ^^ in a script to do it.19:55
[-_-]right, thanks19:56
grayrockde nada19:56
fsmithred[-_-], did you install encrypted lvm from the installer?20:30
[-_-]no, It is from my arch setup20:30
fsmithredso the lvm is not inside the encrypted volume?20:30
fsmithredNormally you should only need to enter the encryption passphrase once to open it, and the lvm is inside that.20:31
fsmithredso / and /home get unencrypted at the same time. You have it some other way?20:31
[-_-]I have it like this : / is not encrypted, only /home/user is encrypted20:32
fsmithredif you have separate encrypted volumes, you can set up a keyfile for the encrypted home.20:32
fsmithredis there an entry in /etc/crypttab for the encrypted part?20:33
fsmithredand it's all in the lvm?20:34
[-_-]I have no setup crypttab20:35
[-_-]my / and /home/user is in the lvm, it has several partitions including those two20:35
fsmithredis /home on a separate logical volume and you encrypted that?20:37
fsmithredI think your crypttab should have something like...20:39
fsmithred<name>   <logical-volume>   none  luks20:39
fsmithredname is whatever you want, logical-volume is whatever you called that part of the lvm20:40
[-_-]fsmithred: /home is on a separate lvm volume20:41
fsmithrednow I'm not sure what fstab should use. This is confusing.20:41
fsmithredtell me some actual names20:41
fsmithredvol0-homefs is what mine would be called20:41
fsmithredand then if I encrypted the filesystem and called it homecrypt, then fstab might use /dev/mapper/homecrypt20:43
fsmithredI'm not sure because you did it the opposite way debian-installer does it.20:43
[-_-]it doesn't matter, once it has been decrypted, I am gonna call it by fs uuid20:43
[-_-]name won't matter20:44
fsmithredok, you might need to try a few different ways. The entry in /etc/crypttab will decrypt it, then fstab can mount whatever got decrypted.20:46
[-_-]aight, I got some ideas, I am gonna try those now20:46
fsmithredyou could check out man crypttab, but I just looked and it might be too much20:47
fsmithredgoogle for some examples might be better20:47
[-_-]aight, rebooting20:51
[-_-]fsmithred: thanks20:55
[-_-]time to go to bed, see you all tomorrow, a lot to do, to get this system upto my need20:57
fsmithredgood luck20:57
[-_-]now I am gonna have to learn how to write openrc scripts20:58
[-_-]I have it has no ghosts in it20:58

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